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Candice said: He's said he's 23--and you're welcome to him, Gillian, if you find him so appealing. I've found him ignorant, arrogant, and obnoxious myself, especially in his b-c communique. And John is right to defend that space for all of us. Spam is spam, and it certainly doesn't come under the purview of Netiquette (disagreeing with David Latane). Nor is there much of a judgment call to make between one person's harassment and another's idea of lively debate because the victim of unwanted b-c communications gets to make that call. Once a back-channeler's been told to go away, any further b-c communications from him constitute harassment on its face. Gillian replies: Where's the offence in being 23? I'm not sure that I'd say 'appealing', but he's got more resilience in the face of attack than I have. I have no experience of Daniel's b-c style, so can't comment on his ignorance, arrogance or obnoxiousness there. I certainly support the view that persistent unwanted mail could be regarded as harassment and needs to be discouraged heavily. Candice said: Those of you who enjoy Daniel's conversation are perfectly free to "take it back-channel," as the saying goes. What some of us would like, alternatively, is to keep the front-channel open to other listees and other topics, while keeping our in-boxes from being overloaded with what we consider junk. Is that so unreasonable? Gillian replies: All lists generate threads that are uninteresting to a large number of listees. Generally contributers to a thread don't need to be disciplined into stopping because threads die out when people stop contributing to them. In this respect they are self-organising. When list members have said enough, the thread will stop. [Wouldn't it be good if we ALL agreed to ignore 'poessays'? Please?] Having an inbox overloaded with junk goes with the territory at poetryetc. I filter poetryetc mail to arrive in its own folder. And I sort and delete by subject title. Isn't it better to take individual responsibility for managing poetryetc mail than to harangue others on the list about what they should or shouldn't post? Gillian