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>Both areas still strike me as curious. I can partially understand Roddy's >impatience with people dressing up conventional work with stylistic pointers >in an opposite direction - how about naming some poets? No point, since I'm generally thinking about beginners / promisers / senders to magazines and publishers. Editors normally see this stuff out the door before it gets to print, unless (see last post) it's earned and inherent to the work. The &s and cd / wd in the work of JHW do put me off it though - I imagine the boy Williams reading On the Road under the bedclothes. If it's a wink to the left, then I don't think he'll get many squeezes. I was thinking though, about ampersands, that one of the best stylists this list has introduced me to is Steve Kelen and I think I see why he uses them. It would be good if he would comment on when / why he does and doesn't. >Are yougoing to make the same charge against the poet writing a sonnet and/or using >the pentameter: well, of course, they're not actually working in a >particular poetical tradition they're just aping? There's a difference between being inspired by your hero to play guitar and getting your hair cut like him. Regarding your thread title here David, and your former status as critic, poet, academic and anthologist of Ye Olde Lande of Mainestreame, these travels wouldn't have taken you via Damascus would they? Roddy %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%