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Mairead, sorry for mistyping your name. As you can see, I corrected it in a subsequent post. As for the rhetoric of poems, sure, I'm interested, but rhetoric in the service of imagination. And, yes, I have written poems that would give offense, including the one I posted the beginning & end of. And others in my new book, too, including a very mean eulogy for my step-father, who is still alive. Bob Dylan's "Masters of War" give offense, intentionally & effectively: "I'll stand over your grave til I'm sure that you're dead." I won't say this but this one last time: Cope doesn't cut it. jd ====================== Joseph Duemer School of Liberal Arts, box 5750 Clarkson University Potsdam NY 13699 315.268.3967 [log in to unmask] http://web.northnet.org/duemer http://www.grammarbitch.com/ppp/index.html ====================== Through the loop of the rusted padlock a blade of green . . . In the bed of a rusted war truck the farmer begins his rice [John Brandi, from Stone Garland, 1999] %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%