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Dear Ishbel, Hi, Some time last year, I sent a stirer asking midwives what value we put on our selves. No one seemed to take note or respond to it. May be I did not address it properly. >From some of the information/interactions we get from in our mail base, I feel it is about time, we midwives face facts and address this issue (our problem) seriously. I mean all midwives - educationists, managers, shop floor practitioners, researchers and clinical practice lecturers and Professors of midwifery. Thank you Dr. Rayner for speaking out for us . We all go to the same market. We work dam hard at what we love. If the public does not recognise us, we must recognise our selves. Do we have to have a visitor to come and challenge us to look after ourselves? How many of us do a second or third jobs in order to make ends meet for bear necessities of life? Lecturers are not allowed to discuss their students' pay when they qualify to go into the world. I feel that this is tantamount to telling us that we do not know the quality we produce. Please let some one tell me that I am not alone. And if I am not alone, what are we going to do about it? It is because of our poor pay that we donot have dedicated people rushing into our profession. A young child who came to do her own investigation before making a decision as to whether or not to join our profession, said, "I am not charity. Those who earn more money are not more intelligent than the midwives". I agree with her. Many Maternity institutions are in crisis because of staff shortage. We need to work out strategies to improve our stance. Dr. Jane Sandell, you began this net work. Help us !. We need a debate. Let some one convience me that we are all treated fairly, by our government and our society. Cheers Bridget I. Okereke Bridget.I.Okereke, Midwifery Education Department,(Sen.Lecturer). Middlesex University, 10 Highgate Hill, London N19 5NF 0181 362 6020 [log in to unmask] %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%