"s.t.champion" wrote:
>
> well, go off-line for a couple of months, and what do you find when you
> catch up with the archives but a whole series of threads about 'celts'.
>
> but blimey, i though this one had died a death decades ago:
>
Perhaps you are less informed than you thought.
> even when i was writing my dphil 20 years ago (on aspects of late hallstatt
> and early la tene in central and western europe) the concept of westward
> riding horsemen bringing 'celts' to central europe was under severe
> criticism by many,
I'm not surprised -- it was the horses that brought the Celts.
Seriously, twenty years ago there was far less attention paid to
collaborative disciplines such as mythology, iconography, careful
art historical analysis, literature, lore, psychology and more. There
were fewer artifacts and coins, as metal detectors were scarcer and
private collector/scholars were almost non-existent in this subject.
Happily, those days are over, although political motives are keeping
that particular attitude alive.
When I first started to publish my views, I received many letters of
thanks from people in Celtic countries and regions. It puzzled me at
first, but I soon realized that they had been diminished by a number
of British archaeologists who felt the need to define their culture
and heritage.
When I examined some of the evidence, especially the selective
citations from classical writers, I realized that I was seeing a
rather typical (and unimaginative) attempt at disinformation. You see,
about thirty years ago, I was in that "business". I am not
particularly
proud of that, but a colleague and myself not only got out of it, but
we turned over all of our information to the RCMP security service
here in Canada. I also did a little voluntary anti-terrorist work for
them, perhaps to ease my conscience -- but it saved property, and
perhaps a few lives.
> and the archaeological data available then and collected
> since simply doesn't support an influx of a new 'people' at this time, let
> alone a single person who could be "confidently identified" as a 'celt'
> (whatever that means...).
This is why I mentioned my previous experience. I hope that you are
parroting something that you heard, because there are two rather
disturbing signals in that statement. The first is the use of the "no
evidence to support" chestnut. We used this thirty years ago, but a
few yellow journalists of the tabloid variety still try it out once in
a while. No scientist would ever use a fact of no evidence to
establish anything. It is not only reprehensible, but it is a logical
fallacy. Its only use today (that I am aware of) is for
disinformation, but better techniques are more commonly used.
The other signal is displayed by: "celt" (whatever that means...).
This
negates those people who identify themselves as being Celtic and is
contra to the UN charter on genocide. Britain has a very long history
of genocide when it comes to Celtic peoples, and to condone this
odious statement would also violate that UN charter.
Funnily enough, there is evidence to support my claims, but most of
this relies on a modern, interdisciplinary approach to the subject. It
would be absurd to try and present it all in email, but I suppose you
might research the cult of Zeus in Dodona for a start, and then look
to the classical authors more thoroughly for accounts of Celtic
culture.
Many of the British claims that there were no Celts in
Britain, and that Celts and Gauls were somehow different, is so
totally
absurd to anyone familiar with Celtic numismatics that we wonder how
anyone could believe it for a second. I am very suspicious of the
politics of any numismatist who would make that claim, but ignorance
might be claimed.
> it would take a long and no doubt boring email to deconstruct this short
> assertion, so i'll try to confine my comments to a few questions:
>
> how would you 'identify' a celt - what do you mean by 'celt' in this
> context? someone who spoke a 'celtic' language? absolutely no evidence for
> this in the 8-7th centuries bc
This is obvious disinformation. What evidence is there for ANY
language in northern Europe at that time? and once again you are being
unscientific and illogical.
> a bearer of 'celtic culture'? what would this mean? where is this in the
> archaeology? how do you explain continuity in the archaeological record
> both during the late hallstatt period and through into la tene? (these
> period/'culture' divisions are, of course, earlier archaeological constructs
> and are only used as shorthand in this context)
Archaeology is not a science. You must, by necessity, deal only with a
very tiny sample of what existed, too small to be statistically
significant, in most cases. One example is Jacobsthal, who records
only two
decorated Celtic artifacts from Brittany. This from an area where
hundreds of thousands of people lived at the time. I know of more than
fifty thousand Celtic coins from the region, though. So the "no
evidence" nonsense is exploded.
The rest of your argument is hardly worth bothering with. If you can
provide any evidence that there were no Celts, we could discuss it.
But you seem to be ignorant of the nature of the Celts as discussed
even by the classical authors, let alone the considerable mythological
evidence.
Are you unaware of the fact that they were often a minority and never
fully replaced the indigenous populations? Why do you suppose that
their deities had vast numbers of regional identities? Are you
familiar with syncretism? have you never tracked any of the movements
of Celtic styles through Europe? have you never studied Celtic
numismatics?
The usual defence of the "anti-Celts" is to scoff, ignore any
arguments, and finally, when it looks like they are going to be pinned
down, retreat into silence. I have seen colleagues hounded, terrorized
and even silenced by people like yourself -- one important writer has
stopped
completely. The voices get quieter -- rather like the nuns singing in
the Dialogues des Carmelites by Poulenc -- the guillotine falls, over
and over, and each time, one less voice is heard.
It is intellectual terrorism.
John Hooker
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