JiscMail Logo
Email discussion lists for the UK Education and Research communities

Help for BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Archives


BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Archives

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Archives


BRITISH-IRISH-POETS@JISCMAIL.AC.UK


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Home

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS Home

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS  1999

BRITISH-IRISH-POETS 1999

Options

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password

Subject:

Re: another chip in

From:

[log in to unmask] (cris cheek)

Reply-To:

[log in to unmask] (cris cheek)

Date:

Mon, 19 Jul 1999 01:35:30 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (166 lines)

Hi Keston, a somewhat disingenuous 'representation' of lang-po ('it' cannot
be represented), let alone of Bruce Andrews' work (which as he knows is
varied and prolific), let alone of the poem posted and its
re-contextualisation. But a garrulous reading, worth making and noted. full
of righteous indignation on behalf of Cambridge writers everywhere.
Although you're right Keston, it's a type of investigation of writing that
is not one that has been of interest to writers in England, Scotland,
Wales, Northern Ireland and Ireland. Perhaps only Tom Raworth has worked
extensively with the one word per line approach. Heck doesn't Tom Raworth
live in Cambridge. Damn! (Even though Tom is a much more interesting writer
in that mode for me, as goes for Kit Robinson).

I think it's also worth making the point that Peter Gannick, editor of
PotePoet introduces the writing as 'for the scrolling experience on-line'
(he adds 'perfect', but we can mediate or even discount the hard sell i
think). The list that Keston quotes is the first section of the writing and
it is in quotations marks, being a quotation from the source text which
Andrews himself acknowledges in a brief introduction, 'Jeopardy' originally
published by Awede in 1977 and later collected in 'Wobbling' from Roof
books in 1981. Its formatting in 'Wobbling' is across the pages and
'justified hard left hard right (which i can only approximate here).

       Words  were  what were  whole  what wasted  words want
       waiting whose travel there -- tips, threats, necessary
       noise  nothing  needed  noise noise  not  order    one
       other's  direction  don't  could  choice  come   chest
       combustible  elements  existed  empties  rest   enough
       expected  how hand  hypotheses  have heard home having
       head here  had having  openly  picture    persuasion's
       . . .

and continues in similar modes for another 90 odd lines. So we
are in arenas of translation. The alliterative listing that chops
across his justified lines differs substantially (and in my sense is
trivialised by the scrolling version). But as Keston will have also
noted two differing versions of the scrolling text have been posted
on subsequent days. Before I give a sense of such differences can I
say that waht I responded to in such writing when I first read it
was the speed of attack and the angles of such engagement, which
from writer to writer might more of less invested in humour,
wilful relentlessness, attention spans, constructivist polyphonic
commentary, slate by slate wall-making, weaving and bobbing.

Andrews has been closely associated with (both on a peer level and
as a crossartform practitioner, the New York School of improv musics
(John Zorn, George Cartwright, Ikue Mori, Zeena Parkins and many others)
as well as improv choreographers such as Sally Silvers. If one listens
to early Zorn (of a similar period) there is a tremendous attention
given to note by note articulation (subtle shiftings of his
embouchure, his shift from hard / reedy tone to soft breath / to
instrument dipped into water / to rasp / to whistle / to whinny /
to honk etcetera). Think about that sense of 'musicality' when moving
from word to word in the Andrews. Think about a timbales player, working
with tunings and rim shots and rolls and offbeats combined. Think how that
might be applied as a compositional principle to linguistic material, to
'voices'. I'm not trying to suggest that any of this is necessarily 'good',
just suggesting ways in which the writing has been written and the aspects
of writing that are being foregrounded. If you don't like improv musics
(and nobody
says that you should  -  although for Andrews that is politicised western
folk music in the late twentieth century) this is going to be nothing more
than
an abrasive noise of shifters. Certainly in 1980 it didn't seem indulgent.

Then one might plug this writing into thinking about 'line' in poetry and
units of sense and Deleuze's ideas of assemblage as one thing next to
another being a basic unit of sense or articulation. Does one move
inexorably down a page or does the eye move backwards and forwards,
stitching sense together? How is 'progress' being critiqued here? How is
commentary being invoked? Here's the first posted version of the section
immediately follwing keston's quote:

Have
Having
Needful
Don't
Nothing
Needed
Can't
Don't
Nothing
Needed
Can't
Don't
No
Method
Vent
Another's
Aim
Fatherless
Why
Head
Inflammable
Paradise
Known
Constituents
Quits
Existed
Sleep
Somewhere
Hoped for
Husband
Pit
Hypotheses
Vanity
Depths
Does
Talking
Treasure
Tales
History
Dark

and then the second version of that same 39 words as corresponding to the
justified version at the top of this post:

noise,
head,
necessary
birth
don't
level
pit
can't
not
order
one
speaking
direction
other's
known
coice
how
chest
combustile
elements
existed
needed
rest
tips
expected
have
clasped
hypotheses
could
come
suitably
having
enough
here
under
having
openly
almost
persuasion's

So, a readjustment of Keston's post, rather than a direct advocacy.

love and love
cris




%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

JiscMail Tools


RSS Feeds and Sharing


Advanced Options


Archives

May 2024
April 2024
March 2024
February 2024
January 2024
December 2023
November 2023
October 2023
September 2023
August 2023
July 2023
June 2023
May 2023
April 2023
March 2023
February 2023
January 2023
December 2022
November 2022
October 2022
September 2022
August 2022
July 2022
June 2022
May 2022
April 2022
March 2022
February 2022
January 2022
December 2021
November 2021
October 2021
September 2021
August 2021
July 2021
June 2021
May 2021
April 2021
March 2021
February 2021
January 2021
December 2020
November 2020
October 2020
September 2020
August 2020
July 2020
June 2020
May 2020
April 2020
March 2020
February 2020
January 2020
December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
January 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
2006
2005
2004
2003
2002
2001
2000
1999
1998
1997


JiscMail is a Jisc service.

View our service policies at https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/ and Jisc's privacy policy at https://www.jisc.ac.uk/website/privacy-notice

For help and support help@jisc.ac.uk

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager