At 08:28 PM 11/30/1998 -0600, Wayne Van Tassell wrote:

>The chimps grooming each other is used as an example of reciprocal
>altruism by so many authorities on the subject (Dawkins, de Waal, etc.)
>that it seems rather pointless to deny it. The cost may be small, but I
>am certain it is measurable, if only in terms of lost opportunities (ie
>time spent grooming another could be time spent gathering food,
>sleeping, etc. I understand the total amount of time chimps spend in
>grooming is substantial. Taken in the aggregate, there is certainly
>survival implications.

There is a book on the evolutionary origins of virtue by Mat Ridley. The
author is a zoologist and essentially states in his book "The Origins of
Virture: human instincts and the evolution of cooperation" that there are no
examples of altruism in animals. This is because there are no examples where
an animal will risk itself for another species or risk itself for a
genetically unrelated individual unless it is for some selfish return. He
provides numerous examples, and states that cooperation exists primarily
where groups have genetic similarities as in siblings, parents and so on. Or
where there is some reason to suspend short term selfish interest. The
example of vampire bats regurgitating a nights blood back in the roost in
Costa Rica shows that bats that "reciprocate" confer survival advantage onto
themselves by doing so. The evidence is overwhelming, and it supports the
"selfish gene" behind all social cooperation. For instance bees and ants and
termites within a colony are genetically related, many of the "workers" are
not able to reproduce except through the queen, so commit themselves in this
act of "altruism" but in animals it probably has no emotional motivation
exactly. Robert Trivers stated too that the "reciprocity" is advantages but
it is not true altruism, but a "tit for tat" behavioral adaptation in
genetically distinct animals.

If altruism exists as humans know it, it could only exist in a species that
could comprehend right and wrong. In an animal this is probably not
possible. I have never heard of an animal being or feeling quilty, having a
conscience. I have never heard of banishment of individual animals. There is
competition among animals that leads to forced leaved from a group, but
there are no animal courts of justice. If a monkey is grooming another
monkey, then it is likely a sister of brother and genetically the same or
perhaps a half brother or sister. Humans on the other hand have to teach
their young to be moral. We spend a great amount of effort teaching children
how to respect other person's feelings, and that the animals must be
protected, and natural resources must be conserved.

It has also been argued that true altruism to be true altruism could not
result in feelings of satifaction in the giver, but only in the recepient.
Altruism cannot be felt as being beneficial to one's emotions; that is, an
altruistic act must be a true scarifice where one donates a kidney to one's
brother or something that is not going to necessarily be beneficial to one's
health or longivity but is done - on balance - to save another person from
dying. The criteria for a true act of altruism is an act that is not
reciprocal in anyway. The terms of contradictories, therefore, altruism is
giving without expectation of a personal return, even happiness, but only
the happiness of the recipient. Certainly the love of a brother is the
reason for the donation, but the gift is completely selfish since brothers
don't usually need to "earn love from the other brother."

Hence the brotherhood and sisterhood of labour unions, sororities, orders,
etc., brethren and sistren of the common live of the "devotia moderno"

Chao Mien

jf






>
>[snip]
>
>> I'll admit that I haven't read up on this topic in years and
>> years, so my thinking may be out of date. If there are any
>> evolutionary biologists out there, it would be nice to hear
>> from them. I'll ask a couple of my friends who still keep
>> current in this area and see if anything has been happening.
>>
        



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