Peter, I agree, the problem does exist within mainstream academic poetry circles but according to the original Argotist piece about the issue, the problem manifests itself more concertedly and is more organised than any individual academic mainstream poetry tutor giving a helping hand to one or two of his/her promising students.
I think Jeffrey earlier alluded to it being something along these lines, rather than the haphazard way it operates in non-avantgarde academic poetry circles.
Another thing that the Argotist piece seems to be saying is that this problem is not one that is associated with avantgarde poetry per se, but is connected to avantgarde poetry as it manifests itself and is taught and promoted in academia. So I don’t think the Argotist piece is anti-avantgarde poetry in principle.
Tim is an avantgarde poet and he too is critical of the situation, as are his friends (who might also be avantgarde poets), as he said earlier: ‘I have friends who privately agree with me but who for understandable reasons prefer not to debate it.’ Presumably they prefer not to debate it because they feel that doing so might damage their standing within avantgarde poetry circles.
Tim also said earlier: ‘I think there are multiple reasons why the issues I raise in the article are not being talked about, and most of those reasons are connected with the problem itself, so it's a Catch 22.’ I agree with him.
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Peter Riley wrote:
Surely what you say about avant-garde poets and their relation to the academy is the same as for any other kind of poet. Of course creative writing tutors promote, as far as they are able, what they think are brilliant students. Before CW it was done through personal extra-mural contacts, and still is. If there is a problem, it is the same problem for non-avant-garde poets.
Some avant-garde practices were invented within universities and have never been anywhere else.
Some avant-garde poets claim to scorn the success which is attained through networking, conferences and all that, as a model of a corrupt society. Possibly some non-avant-garde poets do too.
Thanks for clarifying the issue. I missed some earlier contributions, including Tim’s essay. Not being an A-G poet I have little to say.
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