The 1383/4 accounts for Cleobury Park, preserved in the National archives, have an entry for payment for "8s and 4d for 8 dozen and 4 loads of iron mine from there in the park"; the phrase in the Latin is "mine ferre". It looks as though the scribe does not have a Latin word for ore and so has simply used the local word. Cleobury Park is in south-east Shropshire, but part of the Marcher Lordship of the Mortimers.
David
-----Original Message-----
From: mining-history [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Tim Young
Sent: 06 March 2017 14:27
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Ironstone Mining in 1842 Royal Commission
Sorry to reply to this a bit late, but was out on fieldwork last week.
It is certainly true, as others have said, that 'mine' is a term for sedimentary ironstone in Wales, and is diferentiated from 'ore' - which would be a haematite/goethite material (e.g.
from Cumbria or Llanharry). I dont think the use of mine for pit has any connotation of the material worked.
Although I am no linguist, I think this different usage in Wales and the borders is from the anglicisation of the Welsh 'mwyn', the use of which appears to predate the use of 'mine' for ironstone. I haven't investigated the antiquity of the use of either mine or mwyn in this sense, but haven't, so far as I can remember, come across a use of mine (for ironstone) in English prior the 18th century, whereas the use of mwyn probably turns up a bit earlier (16th
century?) - but don't have any firm references for that to hand. Early written occurrences of the terminology employed by the Welsh miners would be few and far between, and the early placename evidence is rather ambiguous.
Tim
On 28 Feb 2017 at 17:59, Mick Atkinson wrote:
> The word 'mine' was certainly commonly used by ironmasters for coal measure ironstone - the evidence of the Welsh ironmasters to the SC on Rating of Mines 1856 suggests that they differentiated between 'mine' and 'ore' with the latter referring to haematites. A separate working for ironstone would be called a mine but of course they often got both coal and ironstone from the same working.
> Mick
>
> Sent from my Windows Phone
> ________________________________
> From: Lynne Mayers<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: 28/02/2017 17:16
> To:
> [log in to unmask]<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Ironstone Mining in 1842 Royal Commission
>
> Hi Everyone,
>
> In the 1842 reports/interviews for South Wales and for Shropshire, the word `mine´ seems to be used as shorthand for ironstone mine (as opposed to colliery) and also for the ironstone itself. Would this be a fair interpretation - or is that too simplistic?
>
> Many thanks,
>
> Lynne Mayers
>
>
>
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Dr Tim Young MA PhD FSA FGS
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