colleagues

I have been following this discussion on unpaid/partially paid interns
- as it ties into
a concern that we have been dealing with on some deep problematical asymmetries
in many art-science or art-technology collaborations= which can be
really cause problems
in collaboration

often the scientists or engineers get better treatment or already have
paid positions
and the 'artist in residence' is expected to work as a semi volunteer

over a number of years i have helped set up a number of art science
residency programs
and we have always worked hard to make sure there is equity in
compensation between
the artists in residence and the scientists in residence- but its not
always easy
( with the absurd stuff like paying artists who dont have a phd less
because they
arent qualified for phd level pay in administrative systems)

the asymettry can cause hidden/implicit value systems that disrupt productive
collaboration

some of this is discussed in a USA report on improving hte
effectiveness of science
teams- where asymettries like this also cause real problems in collaborations

http://www.nap.edu/catalog/19007/enhancing-the-effectiveness-of-team-science

as a young student in science ( physics) i did a number of paid internships in
different institutions, and of course volunteered in a number of contexts

in any case i think the issue of internships is a good one to unpack- to make
explicit the underlying value and ethical systems at work


roger malina



On Mon, Aug 24, 2015 at 10:30 AM, Michael Szpakowski
<[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> It certainly doesn't - see section 2 of the ACE guidelines, which are the same as the NMW stuff I linked to.  The intern's duties in your ad would clearly make them a 'Worker' and hence the NMW should be paid.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On 24 Aug 2015, at 13:40, Martin John Callanan (UCL) <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> You could argue that, but you'd be wrong.
>> The advert also conforms to ACE guidelines on such opportunities.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 18 August 2015 at 14:15, Michael Szpakowski
>> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>> It arguably also contravenes National Minimum Wage legislation:
>>> https://www.gov.uk/national-minimum-wage-work-experience-and-internships
>>> Even if it doesn't it is one of the many examples of (1) how newcomers are being exploited and (2) how even where there is some experiential/CV 'benefit' to be derived from such an arrangement it effectively excludes those who do not have private means or other financial support.michael
>>>
>>>
>>>



-- 
Roger F Malina
is in Dallas
1-510-853-2007