Sorry Didn't realise it was an issue for you
L
On 24 November 2014 at 16:36, James Cervantes <[log in to unmask]>
wrote:
> What's the problem here? We all have our stuffs.
>
> - Jim
>
> On Mon, Nov 24, 2014 at 10:21 AM, Lawrence Upton <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
>
> > So "stuffing the modernisms of other languages/cultures"?
> >
> > L.
> > >
> >
> > On 24 November 2014 at 15:59, Halvard Johnson <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> >
> > > The word "issue" nowadays is roughly the same in meaning as "stuff."
> (Oh,
> > > yes, I exaggerate, but not by much.)
> > >
> > > On Monday, November 24, 2014, Lawrence Upton <[log in to unmask]>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Doug
> > > >
> > > > I apologise for this question. I have to ask but am not trying to
> make
> > > fun.
> > > > When you say:
> > > >
> > > > >I think you're right that some of us (like me) tend to be too
> > > > anglo-centric,
> > > > thus issuing the modernisms of other languages/cultures.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > and say "issuing", do you mean "problematising"?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I first came across the word "issue" as an alternative to "problem"
> or
> > > > "mistake" etc, a way by corporations it seemed to me of rewriting a
> > > > complaint, making it less worrying for them. I am due later to write
> to
> > > > Centrica, who deal in gas of all kinds over here, who have expressed
> > > regret
> > > > that I have issues when what I said was: they never answer
> > > communications!
> > > >
> > > > If I read you correctly, this is a use of the word where the
> transition
> > > is
> > > > complete. BUT for all I know it is commonplace over there. I haven't
> > > > crossed the Atlantic in 2 and a half years.
> > > >
> > > > Really a mere inquiry
> > > >
> > > > L
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 22 November 2014 at 22:07, Douglas Barbour <[log in to unmask]
> > > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > I take your point(s), Lawrence.
> > > > >
> > > > > Indeed, it's clear the many rods of 'modernism's Britain were
> > confused
> > > &
> > > > > confusing (certainly overlapping in many odd ways).
> > > > >
> > > > > I do think Donald Davie got a lot right in his Under Briggflatts, &
> > > that
> > > > > his account of the various streams is useful.
> > > > >
> > > > > I think you're right that some of us (like me) tend to be too
> > > > > anglo-centric, thus issuing the modernisms of other
> > languages/cultures.
> > > > As
> > > > > someone limited to the English language, I only know such work
> > through
> > > > > translation, but it still allows for a lot. Yet, because what I
> > learned
> > > > > most from are works in english, even there I suspect I red poetry
> > from
> > > > > other languages through the english language poetics most important
> > to
> > > > me.
> > > > > Thus, how I read Celan, for example.
> > > > >
> > > > > Still, a useful nudge to think more subtly & in context(s)...
> > > > >
> > > > > Doug
> > > > > On Nov 21, 2014, at 10:39 AM, Lawrence Upton <
> > [log in to unmask]
> > > > <javascript:;>>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Walking to my place of work this morning I was thinking of all
> the
> > > > > things I
> > > > > > was going to say - and most of it I haven't - in reply
> > > > > > One was picking up on the mention of Hardy. & I wanted to aver my
> > > high
> > > > > > regard for those poems & also a lot of the modernist push... but
> I
> > > > wanted
> > > > > > to say that it ain't so simple(resisting the temptation to go all
> > ira
> > > > > > gershwin there) & thomas would have been one of my examples...
> > > well,the
> > > > > > example, but I was sure there were others. I'm not sure about
> that
> > > now.
> > > > > But
> > > > > > Edward Thomas certainly
> > > > > >
> > > > > > so ta for that
> > > > > >
> > > > > > & I was also going to say that it gets muddling once one steps
> out
> > of
> > > > the
> > > > > > anglo world & away from Ez or can do unless one does a great deal
> > of
> > > > work
> > > > > > Work's ok, but there's not always time
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I have a high regard for Ritsos, but my Greek is nowhere near
> good
> > > > > enough.
> > > > > > And my background reading is still undone decades after I stopped
> > > > > tramping
> > > > > > around Greece. So I have access to a body of work that's just
> sort
> > of
> > > > > there
> > > > > > inexplicably in a largely empty room in my head
> > > > > >
> > > > > > a bit like Syd Barrett sitting there and I'm not quite sure who
> he
> > is
> > > > but
> > > > > > he's very familiar
> > > > > >
> > > > > > *
> > > > > > and the oddity of how some of us start and stop with
> enthusiasms.
> > > > > > Somewhere between pre dawn and my first coffee, that crack of
> > > > Meliville's
> > > > > > about passing a coffin factory went through my mind and I decided
> > > that
> > > > > next
> > > > > > I shall read again Moby Dick
> > > > > >
> > > > > > that's all I have to say
> > > > > >
> > > > > > nice w/e all
> > > > > >
> > > > > > L
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > .
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 21 November 2014 16:48, Max Richards <[log in to unmask]
> > > > <javascript:;>> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >> [poem of the day from
> > > > > >> Poetry Foundation.org]
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> The Thrush
> > > > > >> When Winter's ahead,
> > > > > >> What can you read in November
> > > > > >> That you read in April
> > > > > >> When Winter's dead?
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> I hear the thrush, and I see
> > > > > >> Him alone at the end of the lane
> > > > > >> Near the bare poplar's tip,
> > > > > >> Singing continuously.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Is it more that you know
> > > > > >> Than that, even as in April,
> > > > > >> So in November,
> > > > > >> Winter is gone that must go?
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Or is all your lore
> > > > > >> Not to call November November,
> > > > > >> And April April,
> > > > > >> And Winter Winter--no more?
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> But I know the months all,
> > > > > >> And their sweet names, April,
> > > > > >> May and June and October,
> > > > > >> As you call and call
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> I must remember
> > > > > >> What died into April
> > > > > >> And consider what will be born
> > > > > >> Of a fair November;
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> And April I love for what
> > > > > >> It was born of, and November
> > > > > >> For what it will die in,
> > > > > >> What they are and what they are not,
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> While you love what is kind,
> > > > > >> What you can sing in
> > > > > >> And love and forget in
> > > > > >> All that's ahead and behind.
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> Edward Thomas 1878-1917
> > > > > >> [PF says:
> > > > > >> Thomas wrote his first poems in 1914 at the urging of the
> American
> > > > poet
> > > > > >> Robert Frost,
> > > > > >> with whom he forged a friendship during Frost's years in
> England.
> > > ....
> > > > > >> in 1915 he enlisted in the infantry and was killed two years
> later
> > > in
> > > > > the
> > > > > >> Battle of Arras,
> > > > > >> while the first edition of his Poems (1917) was being prepared
> for
> > > > > press.]
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Douglas Barbour
> > > > > [log in to unmask] <javascript:;>
> > > > >
> > > > > Recent publications: (With Sheila E Murphy) Continuations &
> > > Continuation
> > > > 2
> > > > > (UofAPress).
> > > > > Recording Dates (Rubicon Press).
> > > > >
> > > > > that we are only
> > > > > as we find out we are
> > > > >
> > > > > Charles Olson
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > :: from the desk of Halvard Johnson ::
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
> https://www.amazon.com/author/jamescervantes
>
> Sleepwalker's Songs: New & Selected Poems.
> http://www.hamiltonstone.org/catalog.html#sleepwalkerssong
>
> http://www.hinchasdepoesia.com/
>
> The Salt River Review: http://www.poetserv.org
>
> https://sites.google.com/site/jamesvcervantes/home
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/jamescervantes/
>
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