Job shadowing would certainly be useful if your work offers it - similar to Amy's offer of getting her institution's librarianship students to sit in on some training sessions.
If you have the expertise somewhere in your organisation it makes sense to use it!
Helen.
-----Original Message-----
From: CIG E-Forum [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Helen Williams
Sent: 25 November 2014 11:10
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [CIG-E-FORUM] Getting started - Session 1
Hello everyone,
I'm the Discovery and Metadata Manager at LSE, and like Jenny and Bernadette we expect to provide on the job training in cataloguing when we recruit a new library assistant. We have a training programme that takes place over a month, with plenty of chance to build up skills and to practice what's being taught.
Quite often people will have had some experience of cataloguing already - however this isn't always traditional - they might have experience of describing resources in another context, or of working with institutional or digital repositories - it's always worth thinking about transferrable skills when trying to get into a new area.
I took a cataloguing module at UCL when I was studying for my masters, and then about a year into my first professional role, as a business information officer, I was asked to take over responsibility for cataloguing. Armed with what I'd learnt on my masters, a copy of AACR2 and access to MARC21 I was able to build up my skills.
If you're working in a library already, but not in cataloguing, it's worth finding out if your workplace would support job shadowing or an agreed number of hours each week to learn about/contribute to the cataloguing.
Helen
*****************************************************
Helen Williams
Discovery and Metadata Manager
Collection Services Group
LSE Library Services
The London School of Economics and Political Science
10 Portugal Street
London WC2A 2HD
[log in to unmask]
020 3486 2988
www.lse.ac.uk/library
*****************************************************
-----Original Message-----
From: CIG E-Forum [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of C.J. Carty
Sent: 25 November 2014 10:49
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [CIG-E-FORUM] Getting started - Session 1
Hello everyone,
I used to have responsibility for training cataloguers and agree that it can be a huge investment of time so you need to know the person will have time to spend practising those skills.
I got most of my initial cataloguing training during a one-year graduate trainee role, where I spent 50% of my time on cataloguing so the investment in my training was worthwhile and this is a useful model but not everyone has the luxury of a graduate trainee or that amount of time to spend on cataloguing training.
Amy - I absolutely sympathise with not having things written all in one place, congratulations on getting it all into Sharepoint! In my experience, cataloguing documentation can often be very piecemeal and all over the place in an organisation, so that you really need to almost know it exists in order to find it. Training people really helps you to notice this kind of problem with documentation.
Celine
On 2014-11-25 10:40, Amy Staniforth [mws] wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I’m at Aberystwyth and 0.5 of my job is cataloguing and we have one
> other 0.5 role. I started in April 2013 and have only just (this week)
> finished the first stage of a cataloguing manual and put it on
> sharepoint. Nothing about what we do, how or why, was in writing in
> one place.
>
> So, I have been reluctant to take on volunteers although this is often
> proposed here as a solution to uncatalogued material. Like Bernadette,
> I’d need to know the volunteer was going to stay on after training,
> and to be honest, I would rather some members of staff here understood
> things like LCSH and the point of RDA.
>
> The library often has graduate trainees here for the year and in
> January I’m hoping to spend some time with this year’s as he has a
> strong interest in special collections but he usually only gets a day
> at a time with a team so that makes cataloguing training tricky.
>
> If I manage to get organised before we get our new LMS next year I
> would like to ask staff who run our librarianship courses if they or
> some postgraduates would be interested to sit in on the process – they
> don’t teach cataloguing currently, which I think is a real shame as I
> would have loved it!
>
> Amy
>
> Dr Amy Staniforth
>
> Arweinydd Tîm Cadwrfa Sefydliadol a Metadata /
>
> Institutional Repository and Metadata Team Leader
>
> Gwasanaethau Gwybodaeth / Information Services
>
> Llyfrgell Hugh Owen Library
>
> Prifysgol Aberystwyth University
>
> Aberystwyth
>
> SY23 3DZ
>
> Ffôn/Tel 01970 622085
>
> E-bost/E Mail [log in to unmask]
>
> Cadair: http://cadair.aber.ac.uk/ [1]
>
> _"TO BE ELIGIBLE FOR SUBMISSION TO THE POST-2014 REF, AUTHORS’ FINAL
> PEER-REVIEWED MANUSCRIPTS MUST HAVE BEEN DEPOSITED IN AN INSTITUTIONAL
> OR SUBJECT REPOSITORY ON ACCEPTANCE FOR PUBLICATION"_
>
> HEFCE Policy for open access in the post-2014 Research Excellence
> Framework [2]
>
> FROM: CIG E-Forum [mailto:[log in to unmask]] ON BEHALF OF
> Bernadette O'Reilly
> SENT: 25 November 2014 10:26
> TO: [log in to unmask]
> SUBJECT: Re: [CIG-E-FORUM] Getting started - Session 1
>
> I hate to say it, but volunteering is not always a practical answer
> for organisations which use international standards such as RDA and
> LCSH. The training is a really big investment both for the
> organisation and for the cataloguer – I reckon about 100 hours’
> work for the cataloguer. And training is not enough – it takes
> practice to get up to speed. We wouldn’t offer training to anyone who
> was not committed to putting in a lot of cataloguing hours after
> training.
>
> I wonder whether there are ways in through less-than-full cataloguing?
> We have volunteer language specialists who create brief records
> (reduced description, no access points or subject headings, records
> not exported to OCLC), which requires very little training.
>
> Does anyone have experience of volunteering (either as volunteer or as
> manager)?
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Bernadette
>
> *******************
> Bernadette O'Reilly
> Catalogue Support Librarian
>
> Bodleian Libraries,
> Osney One Building
> Osney Mead
> Oxford OX2 0EW.
>
> For cataloguing advice: [log in to unmask] For course enquiries
> (cataloguing, holdings & items):
> [log in to unmask]
> For other correspondence: [log in to unmask]
>
> 01865 2-77134
>
> *******************
>
> FROM: CIG E-Forum [mailto:[log in to unmask]] ON BEHALF OF
> Doyle, Helen
> SENT: 25 November 2014 10:10
> TO: [log in to unmask]
> SUBJECT: Re: [CIG-E-FORUM] Getting started - Session 1
>
> I think the first question there is a real problem! If you have no
> experience, how can you start applying for cataloguing jobs?
> Volunteering is the usual answer, but it’s very hard to do that if you
> are already working in a full-time job.
>
> Are there any managers out there who would consider an applicant who
> had no cataloguing experience at all?
>
> Helen.
>
> FROM: CIG E-Forum [mailto:[log in to unmask]] ON BEHALF OF
> Bernadette O'Reilly
> SENT: 25 November 2014 09:57
> TO: [log in to unmask]
> SUBJECT: [CIG-E-FORUM] Getting started - Session 1
>
> [Apologies if this crosses with other posts and introductions – there
> can be a delay of several minutes before posts appear]
>
> Hello all, and welcome to the first session of this e-forum!
>
> In this session, from now until 1.00 p.m., we would like to focus
> particularly on recruitment, and we hope to hear not just from people
> who are starting but also from people who have experience and advice
> to offer. These threads can continue during other sessions – we know
> that many people will be able to look in only occasionally – but the
> other sessions will introduce other topics.
>
> My own job includes providing training, documentation and advice for
> the 200+ cataloguers in about 100 locations who contribute to the
> Oxford Libraries Information System (OLIS), ranging from the Bodleian
> Libraries’ full-time cataloguers to multiskilled staff working in
> one- or two-person libraries. Many OLIS cataloguers cannot make time
> to attend long courses and some do not have much inhouse support, so
> it’s a challenge to devise training which is manageable but reasonably
> comprehensive – a lot of it has to be through self-tuition modules. If
> one of the smaller libraries needs to recruit a cataloguer they may
> not have any other cataloguing staff, so I am sometimes asked to help
> with recruitment.
>
> Just to get things started, here are a few questions which occurred to
> the moderators. Please jump in with your ideas on them, or any other
> questions and/or ideas which occur to you.
>
> - How can someone with no cataloguing experience acquire enough
> knowledge/skills to make a convincing job application?
>
> - Can anyone suggest books, online resources, courses or other
> resources (especially inexpensive ones) which would help someone
> hoping to move into cataloguing to make a convincing application?
>
> - Do most people have experience in other library roles before moving
> into cataloguing?
>
> - What if you were trained in AACR2 and the jobs now seem to specify
> RDA?
>
> - Managers: What knowledge/skills do you look for in applicants? What
> else is important?
>
> - Do you use “objective” tests in recruitment (or have you experienced
> objective tests)? If so, can you give examples? Did they help?
>
> - How important is it for applicants to offer knowledge/skills in a
> range of metadata types, e.g. Dublin Core, MODS?
>
> - How important is it for applicants to offer knowledge/skills with
> non-book materials?
>
> - What can/should organisations do to help employees interested in
> cataloguing to acquire relevant skills before applying for cataloguing
> roles in that organisation?
>
> - Is the balance changing between professional cataloguing roles and
> paraprofessional roles (e.g. downloading external records,
> non-structural checking, editing and upgrading, adding
> holdings/items)? If so, is this a good thing?
>
> - What are the career prospects in non-traditional cataloguing
> agencies, e.g. outsourcing firms and e-resource suppliers?
>
> Looking forward to hearing from you.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Bernadette
>
> *******************
> Bernadette O'Reilly
> Catalogue Support Librarian
>
> Bodleian Libraries,
> Osney One Building
> Osney Mead
> Oxford OX2 0EW.
>
> For cataloguing advice: [log in to unmask] For course enquiries
> (cataloguing, holdings & items):
> [log in to unmask]
> For other correspondence: [log in to unmask]
>
> 01865 2-77134
>
> *******************
>
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Céline Carty
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Please note I work part-time (Mondays, Wednesdays and Thursdays) and so may not respond to email immediately.
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CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email, including any attachments, is confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient please notify the sender immediately, and please delete it; you should not copy it or use it for any purpose or disclose its contents to any other person. Norton Rose Fulbright LLP and its affiliates reserve the right to monitor all email communications through their networks.
Norton Rose Fulbright LLP is a limited liability partnership registered in England and Wales with number OC328697, and is authorised and regulated by the Solicitors Regulation Authority. A list of its members and of the other partners is available at its registered office, 3 More London Riverside, London SE1 2AQ; reference to a partner is to a member or to an employee or consultant with equivalent standing and qualification employed or engaged by Norton Rose Fulbright LLP or any of its affiliates.
Norton Rose Fulbright LLP, Norton Rose Fulbright Australia, Norton Rose Fulbright Canada LLP, Norton Rose Fulbright South Africa (incorporated as Deneys Reitz Inc) and Fulbright & Jaworski LLP, each of which is a separate legal entity, are members of Norton Rose Fulbright Verein, a Swiss Verein. Details of each entity, with certain regulatory information, are at nortonrosefulbright.com. Norton Rose Fulbright Verein helps coordinate the activities of the members but does not itself provide legal services to clients.
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