We record DBAs as events, although at present we only use point data. My ideal would be to record DBAs in a separate event layer identifying the area they covered. That way I won't have an event layer that has huge 1KM circles obliterating all the actual archaeological events. I don't do much more than a brief event entry, including a description along the lines of 'A summary of HER entries within a 1km radius of (Grid Ref)', and I certainly don't link it back to every HER entry mentioned in the DBA, but is there, and is (sort of) searchable if needed.
I see that DBAs have their uses, not necessarily for us as HER officers or for our DC colleagues, but for people looking for a more general overview of an area, looking into local history etc.
-----Original Message-----
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bob Jones
Sent: 29 October 2014 09:29
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: DBA's and HERs
I was interested in Chris' response. I can fully understand your position, Chris, where time is not on your side. However, we also find that a DBA has been commissioned, sometimes on the advice of a planning officer, sometimes on the initiative of the applicant, but often without our knowing that this has been done until it arrives as part of an application or pre-app. That said, we often get a heads up on an impending DBA when someone requests a trawl of HER data. If a DBA arrives without this, we can be reasonably certain that it will be deficient at least in terms of its HER component.
I am less pessimistic about the possibility of a DBA containing new information. Maybe we are fortunate here in having plentiful documentary source material, although I don't think we are particularly unusual, but without expecting a PhD thesis, I would expect a DBA to contain original material relevant to the site. A visit to and into the site often helps - surprising how many DBAs don't even do this (I blame Google street view!) - and an informed prediction of potential negative impacts (are there obvious service runs, evidence for basements, etc, etc). All pretty obvious but not always done.
Bob
Bob Jones BA, FSA, MIfA
Senior Archaeological Officer
City Design Group
Place Directorate
Brunel House
St Georges Road
Bristol BS1 5UY
www.bristol.gov.uk/citydesigngroup
www.bristol.gov.uk/knowyourplace
Tel 0117 9223044
(Please note that I currently only work Tuesday to Thursday)
-----Original Message-----
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Chris Wardle
Sent: 29 October 2014 08:39
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: DBA's and HERs
I have to confess that I rarely record DBAs as events.
The main reason for this is the one outlined by many others; that they often do little more than that which I can find on the HER or can easily discover on readily available historic maps (such as OS 1st & 2nd ed., as opposed to say an estate hidden deep in the CRO). But another reason is any new information provided, on the rare occasions that it does happen, is not that site specific (often for something 100s of metres from the site in question.
In my experience, however, Bob's solution of rejecting a DBA is often not possible. Here at least, where there is only one of me and I work part time, the DC officer will often advice an applicant, without reference to me, that the map suggests that the proposal might affect an asset/assets recorded on the HER and that they need to provide a DBA with the application. So often the first time I see a DBA is after it has been accepted as a part of the application.
Chris
-----Original Message-----
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Bob Jones
Sent: 28 October 2014 17:13
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: DBA's and HERs
We always include DBAs in the HER. If they are just a re-hash of the HER, then they are not fit for purpose and I would be tempted to send them back. The message soon gets back to the client if they realise that they have paid money for something that is unacceptable. The best ones (and I have just been through one this morning) tell me things about the site which I couldn't possibly know, such as the impacts of previous development on the site, sometimes from looking at early plans housed in our record office. The ones that just recite what is shown on early maps, virtually all of which I can see on my desktop (as can everyone else, through Know Your Place) are just as useless.
Bob
Bob Jones BA, FSA, MIfA
Senior Archaeological Officer
City Design Group
Place Directorate
Brunel House
St Georges Road
Bristol BS1 5UY
www.bristol.gov.uk/citydesigngroup
www.bristol.gov.uk/knowyourplace
Tel 0117 9223044
(Please note that I currently only work Tuesday to Thursday)
-----Original Message-----
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of EDWARDS, Robert (Environment)
Sent: 28 October 2014 15:58
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: DBA's and HERs
Same as Nick.
Rob Edwards
Historic Environment Records Officer
Cheshire Archaeology Planning Advisory Service
Tel: 01244 973667
Email: [log in to unmask]
Location: The Forum, Chester, Cheshire, CH1 2HS.
-----Original Message-----
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Nick Boldrini
Sent: 28 October 2014 15:51
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: DBA's and HERs
I wouldn't bother cross referencing a DBA to a Heritage feature unless it added information to the record - if it just re-hashes what's in the HER already, as you say there's no point.
We do always record them as events and sources though.
Best wishes
Nick Boldrini
Historic Environment Record Officer
Ext 267008
-----Original Message-----
From: Issues related to Historic Environment Records [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Jason Dodds
Sent: 28 October 2014 15:32
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: DBA's and HERs
Hi,
Here at West Yorkshire we are looking at the way which we record desk-based assessments on the HER database. We feel that it is not advantageous to create a record which just recycles the findings of a DBA and in some cases is just a list of sites recorded on the HER. How do others deal with the recording of DBA's on the HER?
Many Thanks
Jason
[log in to unmask]
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