It's a difficult one. I have no interest in sport so won't comment on that, but I am a musician and on the rare occasions I find myself with spare time, enjoy going to see live music, comedy and theatre. I present both science and jazz radio programmes. So the arts subjects are very important to me, as well as science/engineering.
It's one of the reasons I enjoy opportunities to mix the two and the popularity of events such as Robin Ince's 9 Lessons and Carols suggests that it's a common thing.
Unfortunately in Wales, the Arts Council only really funds opera these days and any other art forms don't get a look in. We have a very strong jazz music scene here in South Wales but it's nothing compared to what it was a few years ago.
--
Rhys Phillips
Lightning, Electrostatics & EMH
x4704
-----Original Message-----
From: psci-com: on public engagement with science on behalf of Sutcliffe Hilary
Sent: Mon 11/05/12 14:13
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in Parliament?
Don't get your hopes up. If Parliament is packed full of artsy types and they still can't manage to get even one arts subjects included in the English Baccalaureate it might not have as much impact as you hope.
If one felt like it, one could reasonably argue that certainly secondary education is going too far the other way with everything geared to delivering the things important to economic growth at the expense of 'cultural' areas. Another odd random observation - isn't it strange how highest earning people and some of our most celebrated and lucrative sectors (eg film, music, theatre etc) tend to be in either sports or arts type areas, (not actually business at the very top end) yet they are the ones being cut to the bone.
You probably won't agree!
Hilary
Hilary Sutcliffe
Director
MATTER
7 Adam Street
London WC2H 6AA
Tel: +44 (0)208 693 0053
Mob: 07799 625064
Twitter: http://twitter.com/hilarysutcliffe
Email: [log in to unmask]
Blog: http://www.matterforall.org/blog/
Website: www.matterforall.org
skype: hilary.sutcliffe
On 5 Nov 2012, at 13:56, Michael Kenward <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Another reason why we need more scientists AND engineers in Parliament.
After all, people are happy to talk about Public Engagement in Science and
Technology and Science, Technology, Engineering and Medicine. Over in
parliament they even have their own Parliamentary Office of Science and
Technology.
Come to think of it, though, wouldn't it also be a good idea to have a few
more technicians in Parliament?
Anything to replace the lawyers and career politicians who went straight
from university into politics without ever going anywhere near a real job.
MK
-----Original Message-----
From: psci-com: on public engagement with science
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Phillips, Rhys
Sent: 2012-November-05 11:39
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in
Parliament?
Yep agree wholeheartedly!
--
Rhys Phillips
Lightning, Electrostatics & EMH
x4704
-----Original Message-----
From: psci-com: on public engagement with science on behalf of Richard Ellam
Sent: Mon 11/05/12 10:37
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in
Parliament?
Those who fix boilers, repair cars and do a million and one other
hands on things with technology are technicians, and ought to be
proud to be known as such. Being an engineering technician is not the
same as being an engineer: I once worked in the Mech. Eng. Dept. of
Edinburgh University - a place stuffed to the gunwales with first
rate engineers. It also has a nest of technicians in the workshops,
and one of the main tasks of the Chief Technician (aka workshop
manager) was to keep the engineers out of the workshop so that they
had no opportunity to ruin things by their unskillful meddling. It
was quite a privilege to be allowed to actually go and work in the
workshop, alongside some very fine technicians trained at the likes
of Rolls-Royce, Parsons, and Babcocks.
Technicians are not inferior to engineers, they are different to
them, and have a different range of skills and aptiudes, which should
be recognised by their employers, and society at large.
I think the 'campaign' to stop technicians being called engineers
failed because it was entirely negative. IF it had promoted the use
of the word 'technician' and bigged-up what technicians do it might
have had rather more impact.
Cheers
Richard.
Richard Ellam
L M Interactive
Science Shows and Hands-On Stuff
[log in to unmask]
On 5 Nov 2012, at 09:44, Phillips, Rhys wrote:
> I agree.
>
> British Gas adverts saying they'll be able to send an 'engineer'
> around straight away if your boiler stops working are incredibly
> annoying to actual engineers!
>
> There's a large group of engineers (and an online petition) who
> want to see the term become protected in the UK - just like Doctor
> and Lawyer - in other parts of the world e.g. France, America, the
> word 'Engineer' sits up there with those roles. In the UK it is
> often seen as synonymous to 'car mechanic'.
>
> There are many of us who've realised that it's far too late to make
> it protected in the UK now - it's too widely used. So the best we
> can do is try and make sure we get the message out about what
> engineering really is.
>
>
>
> --
> Rhys Phillips
> Lightning, Electrostatics & EMH
> x4704
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: psci-com: on public engagement with science on behalf of
> Michael Kenward
> Sent: Fri 11/02/12 15:17
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists
> in Parliament?
>
> I go along with that.
>
> Many scientists would, do even, make good engineers, and vice
> versa. There
> is a large band of folks who get one label rather than the other
> simply
> because of the label that gets attached to their department. Think,
> solid-state physics and semiconductor engineering.
>
> But it isn't just the skill set that matters. Think also of the
> 'mind set'.
>
> There is plenty of historical navel gazing on this issue, often
> fuelled by
> the inferiority complex that afflicts some engineers, who go
> ballistic when
> an 'engineer' turns up to mend the washing machine.
>
> If someone wants to organise an event or discussion about 'Do we
> need more
> scientists in Parliament?', what is lost by saying ' Do we need more
> scientists and engineers in Parliament'? It makes an important
> point without
> causing any distraction.
>
> MK
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: psci-com: on public engagement with science
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Phillips, Rhys
> Sent: 2012-November-01 12:16
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in
> Parliament?
>
> Yes, in many cases both scientists and engineers would have the
> knowledge to
> advise. But they are still different roles. Personally I think that
> the
> required skills set are so similar that most good scientists would
> make good
> engineers with the right training and vice versa.
>
> --
> Rhys Phillips
> Lightning, Electrostatics & EMH
> x4704
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: psci-com: on public engagement with science on behalf of Edmund
> Bennett
> Sent: Thu 11/01/12 11:58
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in
> Parliament?
>
> Isn't the distinction between "Scientists" and Engineers rather an
> arbitrary
> one?
>
> If I wanted advice on genetic engineering, agricultural policy, marine
> policy, wind farms, etc. etc. etc. then I may well speak to a
> biologist,
> agronomist, marine biologist, engineer (or physicist - since there
> is a
> doctoral training centre relating to this) respectively and hope to
> have
> competent insiders from all of these disciplines willing to advise me.
>
> Edmund
>
>
>
>
> On 1 November 2012 11:27, Phillips, Rhys <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
>
>
> But I consider myself to be both. I work as an engineer but my
> degree was joint honours maths and physics.
>
> In fact, I like scientists. But I also like engineers.
>
> But which is better?
>
> There's only one way to find out...!
>
>
> --
> Rhys Phillips
> Lightning, Electrostatics & EMH
> x4704
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From: psci-com: on public engagement with science
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Robert Ward
> Sent: 01 November 2012 11:08
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in
> Parliament?
>
> Mike, you are absolutely right that what we need is a war between
> scientists and engineers to sort out decisively once and for all
> which is
> the more overlooked profession!
>
> Bob Ward
>
> Policy and Communications Director
> Grantham Research Institute on Climate Change and the Environment
> London School of Economics and Political Science
> Houghton Street
> London
> UK
> WC2A 2AE
>
> Tel. +44 (0) 20 7107 5413
> Mob. +44 (0) 7811 320346
> Web: http://www.lse.ac.uk/grantham
> Twitter: @ret_ward
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: psci-com: on public engagement with science
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Michael Kenward
> Sent: 31 October 2012 22:07
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in
> Parliament?
>
> The shortage of engineers in high places is far more worrying than
> the scarcity of scientists. Engineers know what to do with all that
> knowledge and understand how to make stuff happen.
>
> Too many scientists couldn't give a toss about what happens to their
> research as long as someone is willing to fund their hobby.
>
> Fortunately, several "chief scientists" in Whitehall are actually
> engineers.
>
> MK
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: psci-com: on public engagement with science
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Phillips, Rhys
> Sent: 2012-October-31 18:08
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in
> Parliament?
>
> Yes. Chi was at the IET Presidential Address a few weeks ago (and I
> believe the IOP Awards the night before) - she's clearly motivated
> and the
> right sort of person we need there.
>
> --
> Rhys Phillips
> Lightning, Electrostatics & EMH
> x4704
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: psci-com: on public engagement with science
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Barbara Govan
> Sent: 31 October 2012 17:18
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in
> Parliament?
>
> Just to mention that Chi Onwurah MP for Newcastle Central and shadow
> minister for innovation is also a chartered engineer. Though I do
> think
> science and innovation need a stronger profile and leadership in
> general in
> the UK.
> Regards,
> Barbara Govan
> Science producer and communication trainer www.screenhouse.co.uk
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: psci-com: on public engagement with science
> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Haralambos Dayantis
> Sent: 31 October 2012 15:47
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: [PSCI-COM] Policy debate: Do we need more scientists in
> Parliament?
>
> POLICY DEBATE: DO WE NEED MORE SCIENTISTS IN PARLIAMENT?
>
> Thursday 29th November 2012, from 18:15 to 21:00 (refreshments
> served from 18:15 for a 19:00 start)
>
> Society of Biology, Charles Darwin House, 12 Roger Street, London
> WC1N 2JU
>
> The UK Parliament s 2010 intake contained just one MP who had worked
> as a research scientist before entering the House of Commons - Dr
> Julian
> Huppert. With science and technology playing increasingly prominent
> roles in
> society, it s easy to see why some people are concerned by the lack of
> scientists in Parliament. In this panel debate, we ask if the lack of
> scientists in Parliament really is a problem - or are scientists
> better off
> getting their message to Parliament through other channels? A panel
> of key
> stakeholders from science and Parliament will discuss the issues
> surrounding
> scientific expertise in Parliament, before taking questions from the
> audience. A wine reception will be held afterwards, where delegates
> will
> have the opportunity to discuss the issues informally. Following
> the event,
> a podcast of the debate will be made available.
>
> This will be the first debate to take place as part of a Society of
> Biology #policylates series and is being organised in collaboration
> with
> Haralambos Dayantis of Imperial College.
>
> PANEL:
>
> - Dr Evan Harris - former Liberal Democrat MP for Oxford West and
> Abingdon, writer on science policy
> - Dr Phillip Lee MP - Conservative MP for Bracknell, member of
> Energy and Climate Change Select Committee and Chair of the All-Party
> Parliamentary Environment Group
> - Dr Jennifer Rohn - Cell biologist, novellist and founder and Chair
> of Science is Vital
> - Dr Jack Stilgoe - Lecturer in Social Studies of Science, science
> and technology policy expert and blogger
>
> Additional panellists and the chair will be announced shortly.
>
> REGISTRATION:
>
> This event is free and open to all, but delegates must pre register
> to guarantee admittance.
>
> Please register through the Society of Biology website:
> http://www.societyofbiology.org/newsandevents/events/view/544
>
>
> **********************************************************************
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> Edmund Bennett
> School of Physics & Astronomy
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> 1. To suspend yourself from the list, whilst on leave, for example,
> send an email to mailto:[log in to unmask] with the following
> message:
>
> set psci-com nomail -- [include hyphens]
>
> 2. To resume email from the list, send an email to
> [log in to unmask] with the message:
>
> set psci-com mail -- [include hyphens]
>
> 3. To leave psci-com, send an email to [log in to unmask] with
> the message:
>
> leave psci-com -- [include hyphens]
>
> Please allow up to 24 hours for these commands to activate.
> Remember that you will need to send commands using the same email
> address that you used to register on psci-com.
> To contact the Psci-com list owner, please send an email to: PSCI-
> [log in to unmask]
>
> **********************************************************************
>
>
> **********************************************************************
> Further information about the psci-com discussion list, including
> list archive, can be found at the list web site: http://
> www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/psci-com.html
> You may also change your settings and subscribe/unsubscribe to psci-
> com from the web site.
>
> Psci-com is part of the National Academic Mailing List Service,
> known as 'JISCMail'.
> It adheres to the JISCMail Acceptable Use Policy: http://
> www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/acceptableuse.html
> and to the JISCMail guidelines for etiquette: http://
> www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/etiquette.html
>
> Email commands:
> 1. To suspend yourself from the list, whilst on leave, for example,
> send an email to mailto:[log in to unmask] with the following
> message:
>
> set psci-com nomail -- [include hyphens]
>
> 2. To resume email from the list, send an email to
> [log in to unmask] with the message:
>
> set psci-com mail -- [include hyphens]
>
> 3. To leave psci-com, send an email to [log in to unmask] with
> the message:
>
> leave psci-com -- [include hyphens]
>
> Please allow up to 24 hours for these commands to activate.
> Remember that you will need to send commands using the same email
> address that you used to register on psci-com.
> To contact the Psci-com list owner, please send an email to: PSCI-
> [log in to unmask]
>
> **********************************************************************
**********************************************************************
Further information about the psci-com discussion list, including list
archive, can be found at the list web site:
http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/psci-com.html
You may also change your settings and subscribe/unsubscribe to psci-com from
the web site.
Psci-com is part of the National Academic Mailing List Service, known as
'JISCMail'.
It adheres to the JISCMail Acceptable Use Policy:
http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/acceptableuse.html
and to the JISCMail guidelines for etiquette:
http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/etiquette.html
Email commands:
1. To suspend yourself from the list, whilst on leave, for example,
send an email to mailto:[log in to unmask] with the following message:
set psci-com nomail -- [include hyphens]
2. To resume email from the list, send an email to [log in to unmask]
with the message:
set psci-com mail -- [include hyphens]
3. To leave psci-com, send an email to [log in to unmask] with the
message:
leave psci-com -- [include hyphens]
Please allow up to 24 hours for these commands to activate.
Remember that you will need to send commands using the same email address
that you used to register on psci-com.
To contact the Psci-com list owner, please send an email to:
[log in to unmask]
**********************************************************************
**********************************************************************
Further information about the psci-com discussion list, including list
archive, can be found at the list web site:
http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/psci-com.html
You may also change your settings and subscribe/unsubscribe to psci-com from
the web site.
Psci-com is part of the National Academic Mailing List Service, known as
'JISCMail'.
It adheres to the JISCMail Acceptable Use Policy:
http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/acceptableuse.html
and to the JISCMail guidelines for etiquette:
http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/etiquette.html
Email commands:
1. To suspend yourself from the list, whilst on leave, for example,
send an email to mailto:[log in to unmask] with the following message:
set psci-com nomail -- [include hyphens]
2. To resume email from the list, send an email to [log in to unmask]
with the message:
set psci-com mail -- [include hyphens]
3. To leave psci-com, send an email to [log in to unmask] with the
message:
leave psci-com -- [include hyphens]
Please allow up to 24 hours for these commands to activate.
Remember that you will need to send commands using the same email address
that you used to register on psci-com.
To contact the Psci-com list owner, please send an email to:
[log in to unmask]
**********************************************************************
**********************************************************************
Further information about the psci-com discussion list, including list archive, can be found at the list web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/psci-com.html
You may also change your settings and subscribe/unsubscribe to psci-com from the web site.
Psci-com is part of the National Academic Mailing List Service, known as 'JISCMail'.
It adheres to the JISCMail Acceptable Use Policy: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/acceptableuse.html
and to the JISCMail guidelines for etiquette: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/etiquette.html
Email commands:
1. To suspend yourself from the list, whilst on leave, for example,
send an email to mailto:[log in to unmask] with the following message:
set psci-com nomail -- [include hyphens]
2. To resume email from the list, send an email to [log in to unmask] with the message:
set psci-com mail -- [include hyphens]
3. To leave psci-com, send an email to [log in to unmask] with the message:
leave psci-com -- [include hyphens]
Please allow up to 24 hours for these commands to activate.
Remember that you will need to send commands using the same email address that you used to register on psci-com.
To contact the Psci-com list owner, please send an email to: [log in to unmask]
**********************************************************************
**********************************************************************
Further information about the psci-com discussion list, including list archive, can be found at the list web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/psci-com.html
You may also change your settings and subscribe/unsubscribe to psci-com from the web site.
Psci-com is part of the National Academic Mailing List Service, known as 'JISCMail'.
It adheres to the JISCMail Acceptable Use Policy: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/acceptableuse.html
and to the JISCMail guidelines for etiquette: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/etiquette.html
Email commands:
1. To suspend yourself from the list, whilst on leave, for example,
send an email to mailto:[log in to unmask] with the following message:
set psci-com nomail -- [include hyphens]
2. To resume email from the list, send an email to [log in to unmask] with the message:
set psci-com mail -- [include hyphens]
3. To leave psci-com, send an email to [log in to unmask] with the message:
leave psci-com -- [include hyphens]
Please allow up to 24 hours for these commands to activate.
Remember that you will need to send commands using the same email address that you used to register on psci-com.
To contact the Psci-com list owner, please send an email to: [log in to unmask]
**********************************************************************
**********************************************************************
Further information about the psci-com discussion list, including list archive, can be found at the list web site: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/lists/psci-com.html
You may also change your settings and subscribe/unsubscribe to psci-com from the web site.
Psci-com is part of the National Academic Mailing List Service, known as 'JISCMail'.
It adheres to the JISCMail Acceptable Use Policy: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/acceptableuse.html
and to the JISCMail guidelines for etiquette: http://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/etiquette.html
Email commands:
1. To suspend yourself from the list, whilst on leave, for example,
send an email to mailto:[log in to unmask] with the following message:
set psci-com nomail -- [include hyphens]
2. To resume email from the list, send an email to [log in to unmask] with the message:
set psci-com mail -- [include hyphens]
3. To leave psci-com, send an email to [log in to unmask] with the message:
leave psci-com -- [include hyphens]
Please allow up to 24 hours for these commands to activate.
Remember that you will need to send commands using the same email address that you used to register on psci-com.
To contact the Psci-com list owner, please send an email to: [log in to unmask]
**********************************************************************
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