Jamie,

I think David has answered my question anyway, and I sort of half  
agree with him - especially with his phrase 'the inflation of class- 
specific values into universals'. My problem with that is that I don't  
see how it could be otherwise. But let's move on...

You said, "Prejudice is not the exclusive property nor a defining  
feature of the middle class". Well of course. Part of my take on this  
though is that it was the transference of particular working class  
prejudices into a bourgeois setting that set the scene for the status  
of cliched performance poetry etc. I don't want to get into any  
arguments here about the history and nature of the mainstream so let's  
stick with the performance thing... Why has my font gone small like  
yours? How do I get it back to normal? Ah done it.

You said, " Is the performance poetry scene in Britain "resoundingly  
middle class"? I haven't a clue, and I'm not at all sure what that  
judgement would ultimately mean. Does the literary establishment  
really seem to 'validate' " the cliched performance poem"?"

Well, David said the first bit, not me, but I know what he means.  
Anything said here is going to be an extreme simplification of a  
complex sociological/artistic phenomenon but the rise of performance  
poetry in Britain (I don't mean the earlier versions that took their  
cue from the 60's, and I don't mean the more intellectually sourced  
'performative' either) coincided with the whole dumming down of  
culture we associate with the late C20 - often media led and using the  
tools of 'youth' and 'consumerism'. Its most crass and obvious version  
came with the values of Brit lad culture where for the sake of being  
cool, other values appear to get upended just for fun. One of the most  
noticeable results of this was the way that well educated middle class  
young people who appeared as presenters and D.J.s on TV and radio  
began to adopt regional and/or working class accents - it might seem  
trivial but this was just an example of something that behind the  
scenes was going a lot deeper.

With performance poetry (particularly from white kids) you got a very  
similar thing - university educated 20 somethings with a smattering of  
wordsmithery found that there was an audience for their rather poor  
verse, as long as it abandoned any pretense of ambition, the verses  
staying within an acceptable range of subject (such as sex,  
relationships etc) and vocabulary and form (usually a mix of  
traditional rhyme with street meter) , while remaining either  
entertaining or, when more serious, making sure that any opinions  
expressed would coincide with the general drift of opinion of their  
audience. (I know there are exceptions to this, but in my experience  
they are a minority.) Entailed in this phenomenon, sometimes overtly  
but often quite audibly (especially in between-poem patter) is a  
putdown of other poetry as being boring and written by a load of old  
middle class men - the voicing of versions of this opinion often  
getting the loudest cheers of the night. The organizational structures  
and personnel of this scene are, as Dave says, almost exclusively  
middle class. In my experience they are often people whose knowledge  
of any poetry is basic at best - or worse, it appears to be, by  
deliberation. This relates to your final sentence below.

The performance scene has of course another main source - identity  
politics with regard to race and gender - and this remains integral to  
its self image as being radical etc, while what I've said above  
implies that it is conservative and reactionary. This makes the whole  
thing even more difficult to talk about, about how one set of cultural  
value uses another...

I meant to engage with some of your other points Jamie, all important  
ones, but I get carried away. Sorry

Cheers

Tim A.

On 30 May 2011, at 07:38, David Bircumshaw wrote:

> Jamie
>
> I'm not 'looking at the social origins of poets and critics'. The  
> problem isn't simply prejudice either, it's the inflation of class- 
> specific values into 'universals'. The A.C.E report too seems to be  
> both protesting a 'value-free' approach while presenting something  
> that is 'loaded'. I still haven't had time to absorb it fully, I  
> have a decorater's ladder over my head as I write :) , but those  
> sections I have looked at with some care have agitated a little  
> flutter or two  (I smile again, though perhaps with a hint of a  
> forced grin).
>
>
> On 30 May 2011 02:44, Jamie McKendrick <[log in to unmask]>  
> wrote:
> Rather than looking at the social origins of poets and critics it  
> would help to consider what they write, otherwise we'd be stuck at  
> the stage of dismissing Orwell because he went to Eton. Prejudice is  
> not the exclusive property nor a defining feature of the middle  
> class - used in this way the term merely becomes a blurred category  
> for everything that is insidious and oppressive, and doesn't so much  
> challenge a class system, that undoubtedly exists, as comfortably  
> reconfirm it.
>    Is the performance poetry scene in Britain "resoundingly middle  
> class"? I haven't a clue, and I'm not at all sure what that  
> judgement would ultimately mean. Does the literary establishment  
> really seem to 'validate' " the cliched performance poem"? I'm not  
> even convinced that the present British mainstream has such  
> decisively "anti-modernist tendencies".
>    Class surely has to concern questions of power, economic and  
> social.  Most poets have precious little of either, but can  
> certainly allign themselves - or do the opposite - in relation to  
> the powers that be.
>    The Arts Council has a certain amount of power to dispose of  
> funds, to support or not support publishers, festivals,  
> organizations etc. It seems to me a rather secondary question as to  
> whether the compilers of the report are all middle class, as they  
> may well be, but it matters how well they understand the art in  
> question and how that understanding informs the decisions they make.
> Best,
> Jamie