Tom, a great summary, and I am full agreement with your argument.
Indeed the splitting of the manual from the mental was already
reflected in medieaval ages through the concept of the mechanical and
liberal arts (see Harrison/Wood Art in Theory 1648-1815 - though the
concept precedes those centuries to Italian medieval period). The
divide goes back a long time in our culture or the roots of our
cultures, and therefore is ingrained.
I am relieved to hear someone cautioning practitioners from responding
rather too enthusiastically to pressures justifying practice through
humanities theories and discourses. Furthermore, art education (and
design and technology education) has been sold out from my point of
view (and I know I am not alone in thinking this) by having become
co-opted into university systems. Offering education to visually
intelligent, lateral thinkers who might indeed 'think with their hands'
has been jeopardised by undue demands to follow puritanically minded
concept 'theology' .
From my professional experience many gifted visual practitioners
learners at undergraduate level of art/design education spend too much
time with their history and theory modules (which are of use and not
without validity but need different formats of delivery and assessment
which would reflect the more typical learner types found in art and
design education more favourably). Students are trying to cope with
linear logical research task like traditional essay writing tasks, to
the detriment of spending time researching, testing ideas for their
studio practice and to the detriment of free experiment and play. So it
is not uncommon to see whole studios empty the weeks prior to hand in
date for essay or dissertation, yet these components are usually rated
half the module value of studio practice, or make up about 20% of the
overall course in terms of weighting. Although it seems rational to
then say, from a student's perspective : 'let's focus on the part of
the course I am good at, and I have come here for to study', more
often than not the difficulty of coping with such aspects of education
makes students overcompensate their weaknesses. I would like a return
to independent specialist education, as once provided by the technical
colleges. In Germany Werkkunstschule and Akademie still offer
independent pathways from universities, however, the splitting of the
'fine arts' from the so called 'applied arts' is not something I am
personally in favour of. Japan is a good example for why good craft and
design has same status or why that divide need not be pursued - once
upon the time the Bauhaus tried to aim for integrated specialist
education as well (but this is another debate all over again). Gosh but
I am sick of old style and new style university modular systems
becoming imposed on art and design education.
Doris Rohr
Associate Lecturer Painting
FIne and Applied Art
University of Ulster
School of Art and Design
Belfast Campus
York Street
Belfast
BT15 1ED
http://www.ulster.ac.uk
[log in to unmask]
On 8 May 2010, at 18:58, T JONES wrote:
> Hello Chris and Jac,
>
> This debate is bringing all sorts of issues to light, one of which
> could be taken further.
>
> The idea of the reflective practitioner (Donald Schon, The Reflective
> Practitioner, 1983) is particularly useful. Schon regards
> reflection-in-action as a key element in the creative process by
> distinguishing it from 'technical rationality'. This latter concept is
> at the root of many problems surrounding our social and cultural
> values and needs to be examined.
>
> In summary, technical rationality is the long-established idea that
> practice is essentially a secondary hand-based activity and does not
> have the same primary status as pure, mind-based disciplines, such as
> mathematics. The reason given for this is that practice does not
> itself develop knowledge but applies previously developed knowledge
> to the needs of every day life. For example, physics and chemistry are
> applied in the ceramic industry.
>
> Whilst this idea might seem far-fetched, its effects are deeply
> embedded in our culture. It lies at the traditional root of the UK
> class system: educated people think, go to university and become
> managers, ordinary people are 'good with their hands', attend
> vocational courses,and become employed. This is why Victorian art
> schools in the UK developed outside the university system: knowledge
> acquiring disciplines (history, mathematics, philosophy) were taught
> in national universities but how to apply this knowledge for the
> benefit of industry was taught in local colleges. Technical
> rationality has been so influential that art schools themselves
> introduced the idea into their own field as 'fine and applied art'.
>
> Furthermore, I suggest that current artists also adopt a technical
> rationality approach when they feel constrained to discuss their work
> in terms of how it reflects the ideas of, say, structuralism or some
> other philosophical discipline. Indeed, they almost seek to justify
> their work by reference to such academic disciplines of knowledge. I
> believe that this devalues creative practice.
>
> The value of Donald Schon's idea is that he offers artists an
> alternative. He constructs the activities of creative professionals as
> a knowledge developing process in its own right. He does so by
> referring to the discipline they employ as 'reflection -in-practice':
> practice generates reflection which then informs further practice and
> so on. In this view, the act of producing, say, a drawing becomes a
> continuous developmental dialogue between hand and mind, and - Schon
> would claim - justifies it as a knowledge originating activity.
>
> In short and using the idea of the 'reflective practitioner, I
> believe we are genuinely and justifiably researching as we draw: the
> act of drawing can be research in its own right. With this approach, a
> role for the DRN could be to provide a space for reflecting upon our
> differing processes and for communicating to others what we
> do.....with the crucial next stage of acting on the outcomes in order
> to develop our own practices.
>
> Tom
>
> --- On Sat, 8/5/10, DRAWING-RESEARCH automatic digest system
> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> From: DRAWING-RESEARCH automatic digest system
>> <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 6 May 2010 to 7 May 2010 (#2010-82)
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Date: Saturday, 8 May, 2010, 0:01
>>
>> There are 5 messages totaling 7258 lines in this issue.
>>
>> Topics of the day:
>>
>> 1. DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010 (#2010-78) (3)
>> 2. DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 6 May 2010 (#2010-81)
>> 3. Research not chat!
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Fri, 7 May 2010 08:10:02 +0200
>> From: Jac Saorsa <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> (#2010-78)
>>
>>
>> Hi Chris
>> You wrote; 'Perhaps this points to the extended possibilities of
>> drawing as
>> communication i.e the 'process' is greater than an individual piece of
>> work?'
>>
>> Yes...I think you have a very sound point. I hope that others may
>> want to follow up with this as I think that the concept of process,
>> albeit not necessarily new, is nevertheless also a very productive
>> line of discussion. I am also very interested in 'integrity' and
>> wonder how you would define this.
>> Good luck with you exploration ...is any of your work online? I would
>> be interested to see it.
>> Best wishes to all
>> Jac
>>
>>
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.
>> https://signup.live.com/signup.aspx?id=60969
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Fri, 7 May 2010 09:57:20 +0100
>> From: Garry Barker <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> (#2010-78)
>>
>> Jac raises several questions as to types of focus. Perhaps we need to
>> set up some more threads.
>>
>> The way a drawing can be read, interpreted or how it forms a document
>> of a process is a huge field. From the layering of time (impressions
>> and traces) from which we can decode actions and meanings, (usually
>> by looking and developing an interpretation). However this area of
>> thinking can again be sub-divided. Certain other disciplines train
>> observers in the interpretation of their observations. Archaeologists
>> are however trained differently to criminologists. What types of
>> critical observational thinking could be therefore identified within
>> an expanded field of drawing?
>>
>> The type of reasoning with which we approach a reading , be it
>> abductive, inductive or deductive could be unpicked, as well as the
>> issue of audience and the death of the author.
>>
>> This brings us to Jac's question as to who are we drawing for? How
>> work is received is of course important.
>>
>>
>>
>> If we are looking at drawing as a type of communication system we can
>> on the one hand use communication theories to instigate a debate
>> surrounding how effective different types of drawing is when trying
>> to communicate with different audiences. However, as there is no
>> single unifying theory, one could divide the field into the seven
>> traditions ; Cybernetic or Information Theory , (the Transmissional
>> theories) and Semiotics, the Phenomenological , Rhetorical,
>> Socio-Psychological, Socio-Cultural or Critical Theory (the
>> constitutive traditions).
>>
>> If on the other hand we are looking at some form of self expression,
>> perhaps we could open out and refresh older debates such as whether
>> or not there can be a private language or we could be drawing upon
>> the experience of art therapy?
>>
>> All of the various stages of involvement could be either seen as part
>> of a series of connecting nodes or perhaps stages that move from
>> making to interpreting. The reflective practitioner as a model is
>> fine, but perhaps the details of how reflection is established could
>> highlight how different disciplines of thinking embed their own
>> possibilities and restrictions. Again these could become nodes of
>> focus.
>>
>>
>>
>> It would be interesting to have someone like Tufte to then provide a
>> diagrammatic representation of the field.
>>
>>
>>
>> It would be a pity if the area started to lose its usefulness because
>> people were not participating. Christine's point about revealing
>> process is a useful one.
>>
>>
>>
>> Garry
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: The UK drawing research network mailing list
>> [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Christine
>> Turner
>> Sent: 06 May 2010 17:06
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> (#2010-78)
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Thanks Jac, I think this consolidates my comment nicely. For me at
>> present the drawing process is certainly a personal exploration the
>> aim being to determining an integrity in my work. Once I feel more
>> confident about this though, I will certainly want to share my ideas
>> and findings and as a researcher reevaluate through critical
>> discourse, so the process will become communal, if only toward my
>> own ends. But discourse feeds other research...we are back to the
>> rhizome here. Perhaps this points to the extended possibilities of
>> drawing as communication i.e the 'process' is greater than an
>> individual piece of work?
>>
>> Chris
>>
>> On 6 May 2010, at 15:39, Jac Saorsa wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi all
>> Thanks to those who have responded - and so quickly! Just to say that
>> I think my use of the term 'documentation' may have led to a
>> misunderstanding. I am certainly not talking only about
>> 'observational' drawing as such and discounting 'inspiration' or
>> critical participation, indeed, quite conversely, I very much believe
>> that these things are what gives the drawing life and energy. My
>> point is mainly that the drawing process itself 'documents' all of
>> this spontaneity, sentiment etc as well as the subject - be it
>> figurative or non-figurative, and once the process ends - when we
>> finish the drawing - some of that energy must necessarily dissipate,
>> only to regenerate in the next piece. The viewer's interpretation of
>> our drawing is out of our control in many ways but does this matter
>> (and if so how and why?)in terms of the drawing act itself....Maybe
>> another question I could throw out is... for whom are we drawing?
>> Jac
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 15:22:25 +0100
>> From: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> (#2010-78)
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>
>> Hello Jac and all,
>>
>>
>>
>> I am embroiled in a reflexive practice that has lead to the process
>> and my critical participation in it being more imperative than any
>> drawing or painting produced.So yes, at present the drawings are less
>> interesting than the process but precisely because the
>>
>>
>>
>> process regenerates and invigorates the personal practice. My
>> personal debate has in part become (nothing new here!) between
>> representation and the abstract nature of drawing and painting,
>> chance elements playing a big part. I am however mindful of not
>>
>>
>>
>> including a viewer in this process.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>>
>> On 6 May 2010, at 14:40, Jac Saorsa wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Tom
>> I want to say that I am in total agreement...I wonder if perhaps
>> the some of the 'conversational' messages we have all been party to
>> over the last few days might have been better shared privately
>> between those concerned, not because what is being said is not valid,
>> more that it is not necessarily valid on a list where the priority is
>> research.
>> Maybe I can change the subject a little and offer a perhaps
>> controversial idea that is of long interest to me and that maybe
>> could start a discussion?
>>
>> Documentation is never exclusively oriented to the thing
>> documented, since the process by which documentation is carried out
>> must necessarily be inherent in the result. Accordingly, in the case
>> of visual documentation, the drawing process becomes through its very
>> nature an intrinsic part of the drawing, or series of drawings, that
>> it generates. Precisely as a self-generating continuum of consecutive
>> drawing acts, the drawing process is therefore representative of both
>> the subject towards which it is directed, and of its own development,
>> and the result profits from a form of double indemnity in respect to
>> its documentary role. Just as the energy of rhizome (both natural,
>> and as in Deleuze's conceptual construct) surpasses the necessity for
>> it either to grow in any one direction, or indeed ever stop growing
>> at all, could it be that drawings themselves are of less interest,
>> than the manner in which they came to be?
>>
>> Thoughts...just thoughts...anybody interested in pursuing them?
>>
>> Jac
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>>
>> Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 12:30:10 +0000
>> From: [log in to unmask]
>> Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> (#2010-78)
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>>
>> Research ?
>>
>>
>>
>> Many recent contributions to the DRN have been vehicles for
>> promoting, expressing
>>
>> or asserting views about drawing - more or less comprehensibly.
>> Accepting this activity as a function of any network, it nevertheless
>> raises the question of how it supports research - reasonably
>> definable as 'systematic enquiry in order to achieve wider
>> understanding' ?
>>
>>
>>
>> Further thoughts on this point were prompted by coming across the
>> welcome - if unexpected - phrase ' elegance of thinking' in one
>> recent contribution and taking it to mean 'thinking that is fit for
>> purpose'.
>>
>>
>>
>> The Drawing Research Network has the potential of creatively
>> re-defining what 'drawing as research' might mean. It could do so
>> through practitioners individually reporting on their intentions and
>> methods, critically reflecting on the implications of their
>> activities, and engaging in constructive dialogue about them with
>> others. However, the DRN can only achieve this potential if 'elegance
>> of thinking' underpins the correspondence involved.
>>
>>
>>
>> Though not necessarily requiring the use of traditional English
>> phraseology and perfectly correct grammar, elegance of thinking
>> implies that the writer's ideas form a coherent and constructive
>> narrative. Furthermore, the narrative needs to be sufficiently
>> comprehensible for it to generate informed discussion by others, and
>> thus for it to contribute to an evolving re-definition of 'drawing as
>> research'.
>>
>>
>>
>> This is an argument neither for censoring DRN contributions, nor for
>> requiring that they be phrased in prescribed forms and language; it
>> is not a matter of personal taste with regard to the content of
>> contributions, nor is it a wish to impose alien values on others. It
>> is however, a request for much more elegant thinking than in recent
>> months.
>>
>>
>>
>> Tom
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --- On Thu, 6/5/10, DRAWING-RESEARCH automatic digest system
>> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>>
>> From: DRAWING-RESEARCH automatic digest system
>> <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010 (#2010-78)
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Date: Thursday, 6 May, 2010, 0:15
>>
>> There are 8 messages totaling 1636 lines in this issue.
>>
>> Topics of the day:
>>
>> 1. drawing research (7)
>> 2. TRACEY Call for Papers - Deadline
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 16:38:05 +0000
>> From: lynne langton <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>>
>> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about it i
>> do not understand i feel the world is full of interesting
>> things places art for example the German Expressionist show in
>> Leicester Briget RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness
>> of people when i began on this site was primarily from England
>> as i emailing everyone instead of the individual people in
>> Europe were ploite and emailed me so i guess i am not into streets
>> of dog poo but Cezanne and try and i am polite and it
>> is okay to be pedantic if anyone so chooses with regard
>>
>> Lynne Langton
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> Subject: drawing research
>>
>> Is this pedantic or old
>>
>> please have a look
>>
>> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> metabolism
>> anywhere.
>>
>> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>>
>> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>>
>> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> as teens...
>>
>> Once again i do not try to judge
>> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>>
>> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>>
>> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> Don't you see the objet...
>>
>> Just compare viewing
>> arcadian landscapes
>> to
>> doggy streets...
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 13:33:52 -0400
>> From: Venantius J Pinto <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>>
>> Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All-
>> A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> environmental constructs - relationship with people and place; which
>> then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived slights
>> and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even further
>> and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near and
>> far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan, elegance.
>> From the Self to the World.
>>
>> Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as also
>> the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of villages,
>> etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside India,
>> see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> students at F.I.T. many years ago - see me not only as an Indian
>> standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I make,
>> the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>>
>> Then there is the the other Seeing - how the non-Indian sees the
>> Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin to
>> get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often makes
>> travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> counties.
>>
>> I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it. If I
>> am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt something
>> which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing - I am hardly given the time
>> of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their thoughts,
>> ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have more
>> fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you - give you
>> gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path; Damian
>> Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and they
>> are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my right).
>> Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make decisions on
>> their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even things
>> like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going. As I
>> ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>>
>> Besides, and its not a joke - it would take the work of the **latter
>> to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill, but
>> will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common sense.
>>
>> In appreciation,
>> venantius j pinto
>>
>> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> > wrote:
>> > bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about it
>> i do not
>> > understand i feel the world is full of interesting things
>> places
>> > art for example the German Expressionist show in
>> Leicester Briget
>> > RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when i
>> began on
>> > this site was primarily from England as i emailing everyone
>> instead
>> > of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me so
>> i guess i
>> > am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try and
>> i am
>> > polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so chooses
>> with
>> > regard
>> >
>> > Lynne Langton
>> >
>> > ________________________________
>> > From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> > Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> > Subject: drawing research
>> >
>> > Is this pedantic or old
>> >
>> > please have a look
>> >
>> > You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> metabolism
>> > anywhere.
>> >
>> > Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> > are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> >
>> > But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> > When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> >
>> > But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> > as teens...
>> >
>> > Once again i do not try to judge
>> > but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> >
>> > Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> > Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> >
>> > Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> > Don't you see the objet...
>> >
>> > Just compare viewing
>> > arcadian landscapes
>> > to
>> > doggy streets...
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ________________________________
>> > Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> protège
>> > gratuitement !
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 20:03:07 +0200
>> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>>
>>
>> Hi Venantius Hi All
>> thanks for your very interesting message.
>> getting to know other cultures is a marvellous gift of life our
>> societies allows.
>> Frogive me my english is not so well written : as a french :)
>> The topic is whether language should be elegant and possibly with no
>> mistakes
>> I just suggested to compare :an arcadian landscape ( used as a
>> symbol of beautiful language )
>> and
>> a doggy street ( used as a symbol of some vernacular language
>> people use)
>> That was the purpose of up education...
>> My purpose was not to judge people nor art...Just try people to "
>> view " that sometimewords also represent objects...
>> By the way i really appreciate Bridget Rileyand also Sol le Witt as a
>> mathematician in arts :)
>> thanks and best
>> Sylvia CORNET
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 13:33:52 -0400
>> > From: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >
>> > Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All-
>> > A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> > different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> > environmental constructs - relationship with people and place; which
>> > then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> > philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> slights
>> > and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> further
>> > and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near and
>> > far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> elegance.
>> > From the Self to the World.
>> >
>> > Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> > parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as also
>> > the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> > seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> villages,
>> > etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> India,
>> > see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> > students at F.I.T. many years ago - see me not only as an Indian
>> > standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> make,
>> > the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> >
>> > Then there is the the other Seeing - how the non-Indian sees the
>> > Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> > distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> > individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin to
>> > get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often
>> makes
>> > travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> > bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> > officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> counties.
>> >
>> > I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it.
>> If I
>> > am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> something
>> > which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing - I am hardly given the
>> time
>> > of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> thoughts,
>> > ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> more
>> > fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you - give you
>> > gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path; Damian
>> > Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> they
>> > are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my right).
>> > Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make decisions on
>> > their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even things
>> > like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> > strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going. As
>> I
>> > ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> >
>> > Besides, and its not a joke - it would take the work of the **latter
>> > to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill, but
>> > will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> > levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common sense.
>> >
>> > In appreciation,
>> > venantius j pinto
>> >
>> > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> > <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> > wrote:
>> >> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about it
>> i do not
>> >> understand i feel the world is full of interesting things
>> places
>> >> art for example the German Expressionist show in
>> Leicester Briget
>> >> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when i
>> began on
>> >> this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> everyone instead
>> >> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me so
>> i guess i
>> >> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try and
>> i am
>> >> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so chooses
>> with
>> >> regard
>> >>
>> >> Lynne Langton
>> >>
>> >> ________________________________
>> >> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> >> To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> >> Subject: drawing research
>> >>
>> >> Is this pedantic or old
>> >>
>> >> please have a look
>> >>
>> >> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> metabolism
>> >> anywhere.
>> >>
>> >> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> >> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> >>
>> >> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> >> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> >>
>> >> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> >> as teens...
>> >>
>> >> Once again i do not try to judge
>> >> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> >>
>> >> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> >> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> >>
>> >> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> >> Don't you see the objet...
>> >>
>> >> Just compare viewing
>> >> arcadian landscapes
>> >> to
>> >> doggy streets...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ________________________________
>> >> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> protège
>> >> gratuitement !
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Découvrez comment SURFER DISCRETEMENT sur un site de rencontres !
>> http://clk.atdmt.com/FRM/go/206608211/direct/01/
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 19:09:30 +0100
>> From: ana leonor rodrigues <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>>
>> Dear Sylvia, and dear all
>> Well, dogs are nice creatures, it's true they defecate a lot around
>> the urban environments, but it is part of life, like graffiti or
>> homeless beings, unbearable things in grades.
>> None of them exit inside arcadean landscapes, but give me the warmth
>> of beings, the screams of the walls, the struggle of life, which I'd
>> rather have to the hygienic and boring arcadean landscapes.
>> It's true that people are very different, that is what makes life
>> fascinating.
>> Ana Leonor
>>
>>
>>
>> 2010/5/5, Venantius J Pinto <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >:
>> > Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All-
>> > A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> > different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> > environmental constructs - relationship with people and place; which
>> > then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> > philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> slights
>> > and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> further
>> > and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near and
>> > far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> elegance.
>> > From the Self to the World.
>> >
>> > Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> > parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as also
>> > the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> > seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> villages,
>> > etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> India,
>> > see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> > students at F.I.T. many years ago - see me not only as an Indian
>> > standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> make,
>> > the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> >
>> > Then there is the the other Seeing - how the non-Indian sees the
>> > Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> > distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> > individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin to
>> > get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often
>> makes
>> > travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> > bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> > officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> counties.
>> >
>> > I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it.
>> If I
>> > am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> something
>> > which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing - I am hardly given the
>> time
>> > of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> thoughts,
>> > ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> more
>> > fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you - give you
>> > gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path; Damian
>> > Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> they
>> > are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my right).
>> > Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make decisions on
>> > their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even things
>> > like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> > strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going. As
>> I
>> > ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> >
>> > Besides, and its not a joke - it would take the work of the **latter
>> > to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill, but
>> > will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> > levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common sense.
>> >
>> > In appreciation,
>> > venantius j pinto
>> >
>> > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> > <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> > wrote:
>> >> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about it
>> i do
>> >> not
>> >> understand i feel the world is full of interesting things
>> places
>> >> art for example the German Expressionist show in
>> Leicester Briget
>> >> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when i
>> began
>> >> on
>> >> this site was primarily from England as i emailing everyone
>> >> instead
>> >> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me
>> so i guess
>> >> i
>> >> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try and
>> i am
>> >> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so chooses
>> with
>> >> regard
>> >>
>> >> Lynne Langton
>> >>
>> >> ________________________________
>> >> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> >> To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> >> Subject: drawing research
>> >>
>> >> Is this pedantic or old
>> >>
>> >> please have a look
>> >>
>> >> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> metabolism
>> >> anywhere.
>> >>
>> >> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> >> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> >>
>> >> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> >> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> >>
>> >> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> >> as teens...
>> >>
>> >> Once again i do not try to judge
>> >> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> >>
>> >> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> >> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> >>
>> >> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> >> Don't you see the objet...
>> >>
>> >> Just compare viewing
>> >> arcadian landscapes
>> >> to
>> >> doggy streets...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ________________________________
>> >> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> protège
>> >> gratuitement !
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ana Leonor M. Madeira Rodrigues
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 14:38:45 -0400
>> From: Venantius J Pinto <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>>
>> Hi Sylvia-
>> My apologies. I understood the topic but was presenting an
>> extrapolated analogy.
>>
>> Again my sincere apologies. In future I will stay within the confines
>> of the thoughts presented.
>>
>> venantius j pinto
>>
>> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 2:03 PM, sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> > wrote:
>> > Hi Venantius Hi All
>> > thanks for your very interesting message.
>> > getting to know other cultures is a marvellous gift of life our
>> societies
>> > allows.
>> > Frogive me my english is not so well written : as a french :)
>> > The topic is whether
>> > language should be elegant and possibly with no mistakes
>> > I just suggested to compare :
>> > an arcadian landscape ( used as a symbol of beautiful language )
>> > and
>> > a doggy street ( used as a symbol of some vernacular language
>> people use)
>> > That was the purpose of up education...
>> > My purpose was not to judge people nor art...
>> > Just try people to " view " that sometime
>> > words also represent objects...
>> > By the way i really appreciate Bridget Riley
>> > and also Sol le Witt as a mathematician in arts :)
>> > thanks and best
>> > Sylvia CORNET
>> >> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 13:33:52 -0400
>> >> From: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >> Subject: Re: drawing research
>> >> To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >>
>> >> Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All-
>> >> A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> >> different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> >> environmental constructs - relationship with people and place;
>> which
>> >> then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> >> philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> slights
>> >> and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> further
>> >> and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near
>> and
>> >> far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> elegance.
>> >> From the Self to the World.
>> >>
>> >> Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> >> parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as
>> also
>> >> the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> >> seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> villages,
>> >> etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> India,
>> >> see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> >> students at F.I.T. many years ago - see me not only as an Indian
>> >> standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> make,
>> >> the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> >>
>> >> Then there is the the other Seeing - how the non-Indian sees the
>> >> Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> >> distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> >> individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin
>> to
>> >> get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often
>> makes
>> >> travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> >> bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> >> officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> counties.
>> >>
>> >> I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it.
>> If I
>> >> am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> something
>> >> which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing - I am hardly given the
>> time
>> >> of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> thoughts,
>> >> ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> more
>> >> fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you - give you
>> >> gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path;
>> Damian
>> >> Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> they
>> >> are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my
>> right).
>> >> Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make decisions
>> on
>> >> their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even things
>> >> like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> >> strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going.
>> As I
>> >> ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> >>
>> >> Besides, and its not a joke - it would take the work of the
>> **latter
>> >> to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill, but
>> >> will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> >> levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common
>> sense.
>> >>
>> >> In appreciation,
>> >> venantius j pinto
>> >>
>> >> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> >> <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> > wrote:
>> >>> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about it
>> i do
>> >>> not
>> >>> understand i feel the world is full of interesting things
>> places
>> >>> art for example the German Expressionist show in
>> Leicester Briget
>> >>> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when i
>> began
>> >>> on
>> >>> this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> everyone
>> >>> instead
>> >>> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me
>> so i
>> >>> guess i
>> >>> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try
>> and i am
>> >>> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so chooses
>> with
>> >>> regard
>> >>>
>> >>> Lynne Langton
>> >>>
>> >>> ________________________________
>> >>> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> >>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >>> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> >>> Subject: drawing research
>> >>>
>> >>> Is this pedantic or old
>> >>>
>> >>> please have a look
>> >>>
>> >>> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> metabolism
>> >>> anywhere.
>> >>>
>> >>> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> >>> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> >>>
>> >>> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> >>> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> >>>
>> >>> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> >>> as teens...
>> >>>
>> >>> Once again i do not try to judge
>> >>> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> >>>
>> >>> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> >>> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> >>>
>> >>> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> >>> Don't you see the objet...
>> >>>
>> >>> Just compare viewing
>> >>> arcadian landscapes
>> >>> to
>> >>> doggy streets...
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> ________________________________
>> >>> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> protège
>> >>> gratuitement !
>> >
>> > ________________________________
>> > Envie de naviguer sur Internet sans laisser de trace? La solution
>> avec
>> > Internet Explorer 8
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 19:03:18 +0000
>> From: greig burgoyne <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>>
>> does this need to be sent to everyone..?
>>
>>
>> --- On Wed, 5/5/10, ana leonor rodrigues
>> <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> > wrote:
>>
>>
>> From: ana leonor rodrigues <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> Date: Wednesday, 5 May, 2010, 19:09
>>
>>
>> Dear Sylvia, and dear all
>> Well, dogs are nice creatures, it's true they defecate a lot around
>> the urban environments, but it is part of life, like graffiti or
>> homeless beings, unbearable things in grades.
>> None of them exit inside arcadean landscapes, but give me the warmth
>> of beings, the screams of the walls, the struggle of life, which I'd
>> rather have to the hygienic and boring arcadean landscapes.
>> It's true that people are very different, that is what makes life
>> fascinating.
>> Ana Leonor
>>
>>
>>
>> 2010/5/5, Venantius J Pinto <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >:
>> > Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All-
>> > A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> > different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> > environmental constructs - relationship with people and place; which
>> > then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> > philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> slights
>> > and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> further
>> > and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near and
>> > far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> elegance.
>> > From the Self to the World.
>> >
>> > Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> > parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as also
>> > the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> > seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> villages,
>> > etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> India,
>> > see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> > students at F.I.T. many years ago - see me not only as an Indian
>> > standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> make,
>> > the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> >
>> > Then there is the the other Seeing - how the non-Indian sees the
>> > Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> > distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> > individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin to
>> > get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often
>> makes
>> > travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> > bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> > officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> counties.
>> >
>> > I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it.
>> If I
>> > am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> something
>> > which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing - I am hardly given the
>> time
>> > of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> thoughts,
>> > ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> more
>> > fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you - give you
>> > gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path; Damian
>> > Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> they
>> > are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my right).
>> > Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make decisions on
>> > their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even things
>> > like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> > strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going. As
>> I
>> > ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> >
>> > Besides, and its not a joke - it would take the work of the **latter
>> > to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill, but
>> > will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> > levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common sense.
>> >
>> > In appreciation,
>> > venantius j pinto
>> >
>> > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> > <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> > wrote:
>> >> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about it
>> i do
>> >> not
>> >> understand i feel the world is full of interesting things
>> places
>> >> art for example the German Expressionist show in
>> Leicester Briget
>> >> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when i
>> began
>> >> on
>> >> this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> everyone
>> >> instead
>> >> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me so
>> i guess
>> >> i
>> >> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try and
>> i am
>> >> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so chooses
>> with
>> >> regard
>> >>
>> >> Lynne Langton
>> >>
>> >> ________________________________
>> >> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> >> To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> >> Subject: drawing research
>> >>
>> >> Is this pedantic or old
>> >>
>> >> please have a look
>> >>
>> >> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> metabolism
>> >> anywhere.
>> >>
>> >> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> >> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> >>
>> >> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> >> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> >>
>> >> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> >> as teens...
>> >>
>> >> Once again i do not try to judge
>> >> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> >>
>> >> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> >> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> >>
>> >> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> >> Don't you see the objet...
>> >>
>> >> Just compare viewing
>> >> arcadian landscapes
>> >> to
>> >> doggy streets...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ________________________________
>> >> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> protège
>> >> gratuitement !
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ana Leonor M. Madeira Rodrigues
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 22:25:00 +0200
>> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>>
>>
>> Dear All Dear Venantius
>> pls no need to apology aren't we all " open minded " and trying
>> toopen brains and views also as educators as Artist are opinion
>> leaders...
>> as Steve said : aren't we a community kind ofwho tryes to exchange
>> views on facts related to
>> DRAWING RESEARCH
>> the logical proposal expressed as
>> WORD = IMAGE = OBJECT
>> SLANG WORD = WHICH IMAGE & WHICH OBJECT IN THE " SPACE " OF SPEECH
>> AND THOUGHTSthus without judging but asking to which mental level /
>> age / maturation spirit this may refer to
>> EDUCATED WORDS = WHICH IMAGE & WHICH OBJECTS IN THE " SPACE " OF
>> SPEECH AND THOUGHTS
>>
>> is a logical intersting question to be debated
>> and many various disciplines may get linked to this proposal
>> thanks for attentionbest
>> :)
>>
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 14:38:45 -0400
>> > From: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >
>> > Hi Sylvia-
>> > My apologies. I understood the topic but was presenting an
>> > extrapolated analogy.
>> >
>> > Again my sincere apologies. In future I will stay within the
>> confines
>> > of the thoughts presented.
>> >
>> > venantius j pinto
>> >
>> > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 2:03 PM, sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> > wrote:
>> >> Hi Venantius Hi All
>> >> thanks for your very interesting message.
>> >> getting to know other cultures is a marvellous gift of life our
>> societies
>> >> allows.
>> >> Frogive me my english is not so well written : as a french :)
>> >> The topic is whether
>> >> language should be elegant and possibly with no mistakes
>> >> I just suggested to compare :
>> >> an arcadian landscape ( used as a symbol of beautiful language )
>> >> and
>> >> a doggy street ( used as a symbol of some vernacular language
>> people use)
>> >> That was the purpose of up education...
>> >> My purpose was not to judge people nor art...
>> >> Just try people to " view " that sometime
>> >> words also represent objects...
>> >> By the way i really appreciate Bridget Riley
>> >> and also Sol le Witt as a mathematician in arts :)
>> >> thanks and best
>> >> Sylvia CORNET
>> >>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 13:33:52 -0400
>> >>> From: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>> >>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >>>
>> >>> Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All-
>> >>> A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> >>> different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> >>> environmental constructs - relationship with people and place;
>> which
>> >>> then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> >>> philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> slights
>> >>> and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> further
>> >>> and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near
>> and
>> >>> far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> elegance.
>> >>> From the Self to the World.
>> >>>
>> >>> Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> >>> parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as
>> also
>> >>> the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> >>> seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> villages,
>> >>> etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> India,
>> >>> see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> >>> students at F.I.T. many years ago - see me not only as an Indian
>> >>> standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> make,
>> >>> the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> >>>
>> >>> Then there is the the other Seeing - how the non-Indian sees the
>> >>> Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> >>> distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> >>> individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin
>> to
>> >>> get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often
>> makes
>> >>> travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> >>> bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> >>> officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> counties.
>> >>>
>> >>> I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it.
>> If I
>> >>> am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> something
>> >>> which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing - I am hardly given the
>> time
>> >>> of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> thoughts,
>> >>> ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> more
>> >>> fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you - give you
>> >>> gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path;
>> Damian
>> >>> Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> they
>> >>> are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my
>> right).
>> >>> Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make decisions
>> on
>> >>> their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even
>> things
>> >>> like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> >>> strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going.
>> As I
>> >>> ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> >>>
>> >>> Besides, and its not a joke - it would take the work of the
>> **latter
>> >>> to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill,
>> but
>> >>> will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> >>> levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common
>> sense.
>> >>>
>> >>> In appreciation,
>> >>> venantius j pinto
>> >>>
>> >>> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> >>> <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> > wrote:
>> >>>> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about it
>> i do
>> >>>> not
>> >>>> understand i feel the world is full of interesting
>> things places
>> >>>> art for example the German Expressionist show in
>> Leicester Briget
>> >>>> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when
>> i began
>> >>>> on
>> >>>> this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> everyone
>> >>>> instead
>> >>>> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me
>> so i
>> >>>> guess i
>> >>>> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try
>> and i am
>> >>>> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so
>> chooses with
>> >>>> regard
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Lynne Langton
>> >>>>
>> >>>> ________________________________
>> >>>> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> >>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> >>>> Subject: drawing research
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Is this pedantic or old
>> >>>>
>> >>>> please have a look
>> >>>>
>> >>>> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> metabolism
>> >>>> anywhere.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> >>>> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> >>>> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> >>>>
>> >>>> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> >>>> as teens...
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Once again i do not try to judge
>> >>>> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> >>>> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> >>>> Don't you see the objet...
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Just compare viewing
>> >>>> arcadian landscapes
>> >>>> to
>> >>>> doggy streets...
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>> ________________________________
>> >>>> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> protège
>> >>>> gratuitement !
>> >>
>> >> ________________________________
>> >> Envie de naviguer sur Internet sans laisser de trace? La solution
>> avec
>> >> Internet Explorer 8
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Découvrez comment SURFER DISCRETEMENT sur un site de rencontres !
>> http://clk.atdmt.com/FRM/go/206608211/direct/01/
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 22:13:17 +0100
>> From: Maria João Durão
>> <[log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >
>> Subject: Re: TRACEY Call for Papers - Deadline
>>
>> Dear Deborah Harty,
>>
>> I am professor of drawing at the Lisbon Faculty of Architecture. It
>> happens that I am also a researcher in the Space Architect Committee
>> of the AIAA American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics
>> www.fa.utl.pt
>> www.spacearchitect.org
>>
>> where Im presently developing a VIRTUAL project based on an older
>> idea
>> that dealt with the interior of the Destiny module of the
>> International Space Centre, with digital means. My experience is with
>> hand sketching but virtual technologies are a completely diferent
>> tool
>> altogether and does not implicate with hand drawing in any sense,
>> according to my experience. In weightless space this technology
>> allows
>> one to "see" the world from angles only possible in 0 -micro gravity.
>>
>> I intended to send you a paper dealing with this topic by the 23rd
>> May, but hve just realized that it is the 23rd April.
>> I am sending you some material for you to analyse in case you are
>> interested in publishing my work, somewhere . The abstract I am
>> sending you is just a way to inform about the nature of the virtual
>> experience and the just sufficient to carry the message.
>> Please be free to contact me for further information.
>> Kind regards,
>> Maria Joao Durao
>>
>>
>> Quoting Deborah Harty <[log in to unmask]
>> <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]> >:
>>
>> > The deadline for TRACEY's latest call for papers is 23rd April
>> 2010.
>> > Please see below for details.
>> >
>> > Tracey is a peer reviewed electronic journal dedicated to drawing
>> > and contemporary issues. It is varied and diverse with a fast
>> > growing readership of academics, students and practitioners
>> > representing a wide range of drawing interests including fine
>> art,
>> > architectural design, graphics, product design and visual
>> > communication, ideally any activity in which drawing is essential.
>> >
>> > You can see us at
>> http://www.lboro.ac.uk/departments/ac/tracey/index.html
>> >
>> > In this next invitation for submissions, we are focusing on the
>> > theme of Drawing & Technology, particularly in relation to the
>> > following questions:
>> >
>> > Where are the masterpieces of digital drawing?
>> >
>> > Does digital drawing dissolve the Albertian Window?
>> >
>> > Does digital drawing dissolve the boundaries between author and
>> viewer?
>> >
>> > Digital collaboration in drawing â what are the opportunities?
>> >
>> > Motion capture as pencil in a virtual space?
>> >
>> > How does drawing in the third and fourth dimension challenge our
>> > traditional practices?
>> >
>> > Can computational modelling advance our understanding of drawing
>> processes?
>> >
>> > What are the benefits of having an intelligent assistant?
>> >
>> > Does e-paper change anything?
>> >
>> >
>> > A submission may constitute drawings or other visual material,
>> texts
>> > or research papers that have not been published before or have
>> been
>> > published in a different context and also texts and images
>> > combined. There is no word or image limit at this stage.
>> >
>> > All submissions will be peer reviewed by two members of the peer
>> > review panel. Please visit the site to view our guidelines for
>> > submissions and a list of our peer reviewers.
>> > Submissions should be accompanied by a summary of content and
>> > italics should be highlighted in colour. If text includes images,
>> > send images also as separate jpegs. Submissions should be on disc
>> > (Zip or CD and 300 dpi) or as attachments in MS Word with
>> > pictures/images separate as jpegs (72dpi). Send to
>> > [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]" target="_blank">http:[log in to unmask]>
>> or c/o Deborah Harty, Loughborough University,
>> > School of Art & Design, Epinal Way, Loughborough, Leicestershire
>> > UK, LE11 3TU no later than the 23rd April 2010.
>> >
>> >
>> > Deborah Harty
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------
>> This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program.
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> End of DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010 (#2010-78)
>> ********************************************************************
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>>
>> Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it
>> now. <https://signup.live.com/signup.aspx?id=60969>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>>
>> Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft's powerful SPAM protection.
>> Sign up now. <https://signup.live.com/signup.aspx?id=60969>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Fri, 7 May 2010 10:21:12 +0000
>> From: T JONES <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 6 May 2010 (#2010-81)
>>
>> Hello Jac and others,
>> The question 'Who is the drawing is for ?' is a crucial one. Whilst
>> there is firstly a central audience of one (the person who makes the
>> drawing), there is secondly an infinitely varied audience of
>> unlimited numbers both now and in the future: friends, family, art
>> scene peers, gallery visitors, dealers, critics, book readers, etc.
>> The relationship between these two major audience groups connects
>> closely with how an individual draws.
>> It might help others to identify different positions on this balance
>> if I briefly describe my own . For me, making a drawing is a form of
>> an evolving reflection on images, circumstances and events that
>> resonate with my everyday thinking and feeling. The act of drawing
>> becomes a way of identifying and understanding that resonance and
>> thus is centred very much on the first audience: me.
>> In this way, drawing functions for me in a Ruskinian way: making a
>> drawing is a means of understanding the world around me and - because
>> it is me who is engaged in the process of drawing - coming to
>> understand more about myself. I hasten to add, that Ruskin would have
>> been horrified by my drawings; indeed, he would not have recognised
>> them as such.
>> Metaphorically, any type of reflection is a form of self-feedback.
>> For me, this takes the form of an imaginary conversation in which I
>> ask myself questions and try to provide satisfactory answers.
>> Sometimes this involves playing devil's advocate with my own
>> thoughts. On writing this (an act of reflection again!) I have just
>> come to realise that this is broadly the process I apply to drawing.
>> The difference however is that my imaginary interlocutor is the
>> other person who sees the drawing - in a few minutes, tomorrow, next
>> year or after I am dead. As I draw, the constant questions I ask are
>> of the following types: Will this person understand what I am saying
>> in the drawing ? Am I making it clear enough for them ? Is there
>> sufficient correlation between what I sense or feel or think and the
>> marks I put on the paper for this person to get onto my wave length
>> ? How can I make the breadth and depth of what I am understanding,
>> sensing or feeling apparent to this person without becoming obscure
>> and private ?
>> In short, both types of audience are central to my drawing. I cannot
>> imagine how I would make a drawing without a balance of interactions:
>> with one real audience (me) and with one imaginary one (the person
>> who will see the drawing afterwards). This maybe a simplistic going
>> about making a drawing but it works for me.
>> Tom
>>
>> --- On Fri, 7/5/10, DRAWING-RESEARCH automatic digest system
>> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> From: DRAWING-RESEARCH automatic digest system
>> <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 6 May 2010 (#2010-81)
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Date: Friday, 7 May, 2010, 0:00
>>
>> There are 7 messages totaling 3022 lines in this issue.
>>
>> Topics of the day:
>>
>> 1. Research not chat! (4)
>> 2. Fw: Research not chat!
>> 3. DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010 (#2010-78)
>> 4. NIGHT OF MUSEUMS // MAY 15 TH NATIONAL ARCHIVES MUSEUM IN PARIS
>> THEMA :
>> THE UNIVERSA EXHIBITIONS... La Nuit des Musées aux Archives
>> nationales, le
>> 15 mai
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 15:18:53 +0000
>> From: Rowena Payne <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Research not chat!
>>
>> I seem to be getting far too many emails which are socio-chat and not
>> related to research.
>> Please therefore unsubscribe me
>> Many thanks
>> Rowen
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 15:35:20 +0000
>> From: Rowena Payne <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Fw: Research not chat!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Forwarded Message ----
>> From: Rowena Payne <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Sent: Thu, 6 May, 2010 16:18:53
>> Subject: Research not chat!
>>
>>
>> I seem to be getting far too many emails which are socio-chat and not
>> related to research.
>> Pleas
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 17:05:12 +0100
>> From: Eduardo Corte Real <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: Research not chat!
>>
>> Dear Rowena,
>> I'm afraid you will have to do it yourself in the JISC Mail website.
>> I think that news, discussions, proposals on drawing in general are
>> within the general theme of the List.
>> I think that the duty of making this list a real debate list on
>> drawing
>> research is up to the contributors.
>> It is up to us the ones interested in research to came up with
>> research
>> stuff and make it the overwhelming majority of the posts and ignore
>> what
>> they consider to be chats.
>> Best,
>> Eduardo Corte-Real
>> Dr Arch. Ass. Prof. IADE, Lisbon
>>
>>
>> On 06-05-2010 16:18, Rowena Payne wrote:
>> > I seem to be getting far too many emails which are socio-chat and
>> not
>> > related to research.
>> > Please therefore unsubscribe me
>> > Many thanks
>> > Rowena Payne
>> >
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 17:06:18 +0100
>> From: Christine Turner <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> (#2010-78)
>>
>> Hi,
>> Thanks Jac, I think this consolidates my comment nicely. For me at
>> present the drawing process is certainly a personal exploration the
>> aim being to determining an integrity in my work. Once I feel more
>> confident about this though, I will certainly want to share my ideas
>> and findings and as a researcher reevaluate through critical
>> discourse, so the process will become communal, if only toward my
>> own ends. But discourse feeds other research...we are back to the
>> rhizome here. Perhaps this points to the extended possibilities of
>> drawing as communication i.e the 'process' is greater than an
>> individual piece of work?
>> Chris
>> On 6 May 2010, at 15:39, Jac Saorsa wrote:
>>
>> > Hi all
>> > Thanks to those who have responded - and so quickly! Just to say
>> > that I think my use of the term 'documentation' may have led to a
>> > misunderstanding. I am certainly not talking only about
>> > 'observational' drawing as such and discounting 'inspiration' or
>> > critical participation, indeed, quite conversely, I very much
>> > believe that these things are what gives the drawing life and
>> > energy. My point is mainly that the drawing process itself
>> > 'documents' all of this spontaneity, sentiment etc as well as the
>> > subject - be it figurative or non-figurative, and once the process
>> > ends - when we finish the drawing - some of that energy must
>> > necessarily dissipate, only to regenerate in the next piece. The
>> > viewer's interpretation of our drawing is out of our control in
>> > many ways but does this matter (and if so how and why?)in terms of
>> > the drawing act itself....Maybe another question I could throw out
>> > is... for whom are we drawing?
>> > Jac
>> > Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 15:22:25 +0100
>> > From: [log in to unmask]
>> > Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> > (#2010-78)
>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>> >
>> > Hello Jac and all,
>> >
>> > I am embroiled in a reflexive practice that has lead to the
>> > process and my critical participation in it being more imperative
>> > than any drawing or painting produced.So yes, at present the
>> > drawings are less interesting than the process but precisely
>> > because the
>> >
>> > process regenerates and invigorates the personal practice. My
>> > personal debate has in part become (nothing new here!) between
>> > representation and the abstract nature of drawing and painting,
>> > chance elements playing a big part. I am however mindful of not
>> >
>> > including a viewer in this process.
>> > Chris
>> >
>> > On 6 May 2010, at 14:40, Jac Saorsa wrote:
>> >
>> > Hi Tom
>> > I want to say that I am in total agreement...I wonder if perhaps
>> > the some of the 'conversational' messages we have all been party to
>> > over the last few days might have been better shared privately
>> > between those concerned, not because what is being said is not
>> > valid, more that it is not necessarily valid on a list where the
>> > priority is research.
>> > Maybe I can change the subject a little and offer a perhaps
>> > controversial idea that is of long interest to me and that maybe
>> > could start a discussion?
>> > Documentation is never exclusively oriented to the thing
>> > documented, since the process by which documentation is carried out
>> > must necessarily be inherent in the result. Accordingly, in the
>> > case of visual documentation, the drawing process becomes through
>> > its very nature an intrinsic part of the drawing, or series of
>> > drawings, that it generates. Precisely as a self-generating
>> > continuum of consecutive drawing acts, the drawing process is
>> > therefore representative of both the subject towards which it is
>> > directed, and of its own development, and the result profits from a
>> > form of double indemnity in respect to its documentary role. Just
>> > as the energy of rhizome (both natural, and as in Deleuze's
>> > conceptual construct) surpasses the necessity for it either to grow
>> > in any one direction, or indeed ever stop growing at all, could it
>> > be that drawings themselves are of less interest, than the manner
>> > in which they came to be?
>> > Thoughts...just thoughts...anybody interested in pursuing them?
>> > Jac
>> >
>> >
>> > Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 12:30:10 +0000
>> > From: [log in to unmask]
>> > Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> > (#2010-78)
>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>> >
>> > Hello,
>> >
>> > Research ?
>> >
>> > Many recent contributions to the DRN have been vehicles for
>> > promoting, expressing
>> > or asserting views about drawing - more or less comprehensibly.
>> > Accepting this activity as a function of any network, it
>> > nevertheless raises the question of how it supports research -
>> > reasonably definable as 'systematic enquiry in order to achieve
>> > wider understanding' ?
>> >
>> > Further thoughts on this point were prompted by coming across the
>> > welcome - if unexpected - phrase ' elegance of thinking' in one
>> > recent contribution and taking it to mean 'thinking that is fit for
>> > purpose'.
>> >
>> > The Drawing Research Network has the potential of creatively re-
>> > defining what 'drawing as research' might mean. It could do so
>> > through practitioners individually reporting on their intentions
>> > and methods, critically reflecting on the implications of their
>> > activities, and engaging in constructive dialogue about them with
>> > others. However, the DRN can only achieve this potential if
>> > 'elegance of thinking' underpins the correspondence involved.
>> >
>> > Though not necessarily requiring the use of traditional English
>> > phraseology and perfectly correct grammar, elegance of thinking
>> > implies that the writer's ideas form a coherent and constructive
>> > narrative. Furthermore, the narrative needs to be sufficiently
>> > comprehensible for it to generate informed discussion by others,
>> > and thus for it to contribute to an evolving re-definition of
>> > 'drawing as research'.
>> >
>> > This is an argument neither for censoring DRN contributions, nor
>> > for requiring that they be phrased in prescribed forms and
>> > language; it is not a matter of personal taste with regard to the
>> > content of contributions, nor is it a wish to impose alien values
>> > on others. It is however, a request for much more elegant thinking
>> > than in recent months.
>> >
>> > Tom
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --- On Thu, 6/5/10, DRAWING-RESEARCH automatic digest system
>> > <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> >
>> > From: DRAWING-RESEARCH automatic digest system
>> > <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> (#2010-78)
>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>> > Date: Thursday, 6 May, 2010, 0:15
>> >
>> > There are 8 messages totaling 1636 lines in this issue.
>> >
>> > Topics of the day:
>> >
>> > 1. drawing research (7)
>> > 2. TRACEY Call for Papers - Deadline
>> >
>> >
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 16:38:05 +0000
>> > From: lynne langton <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> >
>> > bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about it
>>
>> > i do not understand i feel the world is full of interesting
>> > things places art for example the German Expressionist show in
>> > Leicester Briget RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness
>> > of people when i began on this site was primarily from
>> > England as i emailing everyone instead of the individual
>> > people in Europe were ploite and emailed me so i guess i am not
>> > into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try and i am
>> > polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so chooses
>>
>> > with regard
>> >
>> > Lynne Langton
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ________________________________
>> > From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>> > Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> > Subject: drawing research
>> >
>> > Is this pedantic or old
>> >
>> > please have a look
>> >
>> > You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> > metabolism
>> > anywhere.
>> >
>> > Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> > are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> >
>> > But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> > When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> >
>> > But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> > as teens...
>> >
>> > Once again i do not try to judge
>> > but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> >
>> > Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> > Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> >
>> > Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> > Don't you see the objet...
>> >
>> > Just compare viewing
>> > arcadian landscapes
>> > to
>> > doggy streets...
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ________________________________
>> > Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 13:33:52 -0400
>> > From: Venantius J Pinto <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> >
>> > Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All—
>> > A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> > different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> > environmental constructs — relationship with people and place; which
>> > then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> > philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> slights
>> > and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> further
>> > and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near and
>> > far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> elegance.
>> > From the Self to the World.
>> >
>> > Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> > parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as
>> also
>> > the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> > seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> villages,
>> > etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> India,
>> > see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> > students at F.I.T. many years ago — see me not only as an Indian
>> > standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> make,
>> > the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> >
>> > Then there is the the other Seeing — how the non-Indian sees the
>> > Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> > distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> > individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin to
>> > get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often
>> makes
>> > travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> > bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> > officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> counties.
>> >
>> > I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it.
>> If I
>> > am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> something
>> > which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing — I am hardly given the
>> time
>> > of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> thoughts,
>> > ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> more
>> > fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you — give you
>> > gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path; Damian
>> > Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> they
>> > are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my right).
>> > Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make decisions on
>> > their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even things
>> > like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> > strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going. As
>> I
>> > ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> >
>> > Besides, and its not a joke — it would take the work of the **latter
>> > to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill, but
>> > will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> > levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common sense.
>> >
>> > In appreciation,
>> > venantius j pinto
>> >
>> > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> > <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > > bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about
>> > it i do not
>> > > understand i feel the world is full of interesting things
>> > places
>> > > art for example the German Expressionist show in Leicester
>> > Briget
>> > > RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when
>> i
>> > began on
>> > > this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> > everyone instead
>> > > of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me
>> > so i guess i
>> > > am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try
>> > and i am
>> > > polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so
>> > chooses with
>> > > regard
>> > >
>> > > Lynne Langton
>> > >
>> > > ________________________________
>> > > From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > > To: [log in to unmask]
>> > > Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> > > Subject: drawing research
>> > >
>> > > Is this pedantic or old
>> > >
>> > > please have a look
>> > >
>> > > You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> > metabolism
>> > > anywhere.
>> > >
>> > > Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> > > are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> > >
>> > > But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> > > When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> > >
>> > > But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> > > as teens...
>> > >
>> > > Once again i do not try to judge
>> > > but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> > >
>> > > Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> > > Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> > >
>> > > Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> > > Don't you see the objet...
>> > >
>> > > Just compare viewing
>> > > arcadian landscapes
>> > > to
>> > > doggy streets...
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > ________________________________
>> > > Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> > protège
>> > > gratuitement !
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 20:03:07 +0200
>> > From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> >
>> >
>> > Hi Venantius Hi All
>> > thanks for your very interesting message.
>> > getting to know other cultures is a marvellous gift of life our
>> > societies allows.
>> > Frogive me my english is not so well written : as a french :)
>> > The topic is whether language should be elegant and possibly with
>> > no mistakes
>> > I just suggested to compare :an arcadian landscape ( used as a
>> > symbol of beautiful language )
>> > and
>> > a doggy street ( used as a symbol of some vernacular language
>> > people use)
>> > That was the purpose of up education...
>> > My purpose was not to judge people nor art...Just try people to "
>> > view " that sometimewords also represent objects...
>> > By the way i really appreciate Bridget Rileyand also Sol le Witt as
>> > a mathematician in arts :)
>> > thanks and best
>> > Sylvia CORNET
>> > > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 13:33:52 -0400
>> > > From: [log in to unmask]
>> > > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> > > To: [log in to unmask]
>> > >
>> > > Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All—
>> > > A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> > > different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> > > environmental constructs — relationship with people and place;
>> which
>> > > then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> > > philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> > slights
>> > > and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> > further
>> > > and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near
>> and
>> > > far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> > elegance.
>> > > From the Self to the World.
>> > >
>> > > Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> > > parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as
>> also
>> > > the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> > > seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> > villages,
>> > > etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> > India,
>> > > see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> > > students at F.I.T. many years ago — see me not only as an Indian
>> > > standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> > make,
>> > > the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> > >
>> > > Then there is the the other Seeing — how the non-Indian sees the
>> > > Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> > > distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> > > individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin
>> to
>> > > get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often
>> > makes
>> > > travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> > > bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> > > officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> > counties.
>> > >
>> > > I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it.
>> > If I
>> > > am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> > something
>> > > which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing — I am hardly given the
>> > time
>> > > of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> > thoughts,
>> > > ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> > more
>> > > fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you — give you
>> > > gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path;
>> Damian
>> > > Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> > they
>> > > are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my
>> right).
>> > > Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make decisions
>> on
>> > > their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even
>> things
>> > > like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> > > strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going.
>> > As I
>> > > ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> > >
>> > > Besides, and its not a joke — it would take the work of the
>> **latter
>> > > to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill,
>> but
>> > > will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> > > levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common
>> sense.
>> > >
>> > > In appreciation,
>> > > venantius j pinto
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> > > <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > >> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about
>> > it i do not
>> > >> understand i feel the world is full of interesting
>> > things places
>> > >> art for example the German Expressionist show in Leicester
>> > Briget
>> > >> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when
>> > i began on
>> > >> this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> > everyone instead
>> > >> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me
>> > so i guess i
>> > >> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try
>> > and i am
>> > >> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so
>> > chooses with
>> > >> regard
>> > >>
>> > >> Lynne Langton
>> > >>
>> > >> ________________________________
>> > >> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > >> To: [log in to unmask]
>> > >> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> > >> Subject: drawing research
>> > >>
>> > >> Is this pedantic or old
>> > >>
>> > >> please have a look
>> > >>
>> > >> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> > metabolism
>> > >> anywhere.
>> > >>
>> > >> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> > >> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> > >>
>> > >> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> > >> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> > >>
>> > >> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> > >> as teens...
>> > >>
>> > >> Once again i do not try to judge
>> > >> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> > >>
>> > >> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> > >> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> > >>
>> > >> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> > >> Don't you see the objet...
>> > >>
>> > >> Just compare viewing
>> > >> arcadian landscapes
>> > >> to
>> > >> doggy streets...
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> ________________________________
>> > >> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> > protège
>> > >> gratuitement !
>> >
>> > _________________________________________________________________
>> > Découvrez comment SURFER DISCRETEMENT sur un site de rencontres !
>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/FRM/go/206608211/direct/01/
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 19:09:30 +0100
>> > From: ana leonor rodrigues <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> >
>> > Dear Sylvia, and dear all
>> > Well, dogs are nice creatures, it’s true they defecate a lot around
>> > the urban environments, but it is part of life, like graffiti or
>> > homeless beings, unbearable things in grades.
>> > None of them exit inside arcadean landscapes, but give me the warmth
>> > of beings, the screams of the walls, the struggle of life, which I’d
>> > rather have to the hygienic and boring arcadean landscapes.
>> > It’s true that people are very different, that is what makes life
>> > fascinating.
>> > Ana Leonor
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 2010/5/5, Venantius J Pinto <[log in to unmask]>:
>> > > Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All—
>> > > A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> > > different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> > > environmental constructs — relationship with people and place;
>> which
>> > > then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> > > philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> > slights
>> > > and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> > further
>> > > and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near
>> and
>> > > far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> > elegance.
>> > > From the Self to the World.
>> > >
>> > > Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> > > parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as
>> also
>> > > the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> > > seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> > villages,
>> > > etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> > India,
>> > > see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> > > students at F.I.T. many years ago — see me not only as an Indian
>> > > standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> > make,
>> > > the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> > >
>> > > Then there is the the other Seeing — how the non-Indian sees the
>> > > Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> > > distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> > > individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin
>> to
>> > > get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often
>> > makes
>> > > travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> > > bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> > > officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> > counties.
>> > >
>> > > I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it.
>> > If I
>> > > am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> > something
>> > > which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing — I am hardly given the
>> > time
>> > > of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> > thoughts,
>> > > ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> > more
>> > > fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you — give you
>> > > gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path;
>> Damian
>> > > Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> > they
>> > > are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my
>> right).
>> > > Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make
>> decisions on
>> > > their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even
>> things
>> > > like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> > > strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going.
>> > As I
>> > > ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> > >
>> > > Besides, and its not a joke — it would take the work of the
>> **latter
>> > > to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill,
>> but
>> > > will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> > > levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common
>> sense.
>> > >
>> > > In appreciation,
>> > > venantius j pinto
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> > > <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > >> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about
>> > it i do
>> > >> not
>> > >> understand i feel the world is full of interesting
>> > things places
>> > >> art for example the German Expressionist show in Leicester
>> > Briget
>> > >> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when
>> > i began
>> > >> on
>> > >> this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> everyone
>> > >> instead
>> > >> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me
>> > so i guess
>> > >> i
>> > >> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try
>> > and i am
>> > >> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so
>> > chooses with
>> > >> regard
>> > >>
>> > >> Lynne Langton
>> > >>
>> > >> ________________________________
>> > >> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > >> To: [log in to unmask]
>> > >> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> > >> Subject: drawing research
>> > >>
>> > >> Is this pedantic or old
>> > >>
>> > >> please have a look
>> > >>
>> > >> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> > metabolism
>> > >> anywhere.
>> > >>
>> > >> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> > >> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> > >>
>> > >> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> > >> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> > >>
>> > >> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> > >> as teens...
>> > >>
>> > >> Once again i do not try to judge
>> > >> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> > >>
>> > >> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> > >> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> > >>
>> > >> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> > >> Don't you see the objet...
>> > >>
>> > >> Just compare viewing
>> > >> arcadian landscapes
>> > >> to
>> > >> doggy streets...
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> ________________________________
>> > >> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> > protège
>> > >> gratuitement !
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Ana Leonor M. Madeira Rodrigues
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 14:38:45 -0400
>> > From: Venantius J Pinto <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> >
>> > Hi Sylvia—
>> > My apologies. I understood the topic but was presenting an
>> > extrapolated analogy.
>> >
>> > Again my sincere apologies. In future I will stay within the
>> confines
>> > of the thoughts presented.
>> >
>> > venantius j pinto
>> >
>> > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 2:03 PM, sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > wrote:
>> > > Hi Venantius Hi All
>> > > thanks for your very interesting message.
>> > > getting to know other cultures is a marvellous gift of life our
>> > societies
>> > > allows.
>> > > Frogive me my english is not so well written : as a french :)
>> > > The topic is whether
>> > > language should be elegant and possibly with no mistakes
>> > > I just suggested to compare :
>> > > an arcadian landscape ( used as a symbol of beautiful language )
>> > > and
>> > > a doggy street ( used as a symbol of some vernacular language
>> > people use)
>> > > That was the purpose of up education...
>> > > My purpose was not to judge people nor art...
>> > > Just try people to " view " that sometime
>> > > words also represent objects...
>> > > By the way i really appreciate Bridget Riley
>> > > and also Sol le Witt as a mathematician in arts :)
>> > > thanks and best
>> > > Sylvia CORNET
>> > >> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 13:33:52 -0400
>> > >> From: [log in to unmask]
>> > >> Subject: Re: drawing research
>> > >> To: [log in to unmask]
>> > >>
>> > >> Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All—
>> > >> A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> > >> different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with
>> ones
>> > >> environmental constructs — relationship with people and place;
>> > which
>> > >> then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones
>> group,
>> > >> philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> > slights
>> > >> and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> > further
>> > >> and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near
>> > and
>> > >> far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> > elegance.
>> > >> From the Self to the World.
>> > >>
>> > >> Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> > >> parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as
>> > also
>> > >> the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> > >> seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> > villages,
>> > >> etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> > India,
>> > >> see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> > >> students at F.I.T. many years ago — see me not only as an Indian
>> > >> standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> > make,
>> > >> the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> > >>
>> > >> Then there is the the other Seeing — how the non-Indian sees the
>> > >> Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> > >> distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> > >> individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we
>> > begin to
>> > >> get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport
>> often
>> > makes
>> > >> travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> > >> bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> > >> officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> > counties.
>> > >>
>> > >> I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of
>> > it. If I
>> > >> am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> > something
>> > >> which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing — I am hardly given
>> > the time
>> > >> of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> > thoughts,
>> > >> ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> > more
>> > >> fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you — give you
>> > >> gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path;
>> > Damian
>> > >> Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> > they
>> > >> are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my
>> > right).
>> > >> Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make
>> > decisions on
>> > >> their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even
>> things
>> > >> like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> > >> strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going.
>> > As I
>> > >> ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> > >>
>> > >> Besides, and its not a joke — it would take the work of the
>> > **latter
>> > >> to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill,
>> but
>> > >> will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> > >> levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common
>> > sense.
>> > >>
>> > >> In appreciation,
>> > >> venantius j pinto
>> > >>
>> > >> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> > >> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > >>> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about
>> > it i do
>> > >>> not
>> > >>> understand i feel the world is full of interesting
>> > things places
>> > >>> art for example the German Expressionist show in Leicester
>> > Briget
>> > >>> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when
>> > i began
>> > >>> on
>> > >>> this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> > everyone
>> > >>> instead
>> > >>> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me
>> > so i
>> > >>> guess i
>> > >>> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try
>> > and i am
>> > >>> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so
>> > chooses with
>> > >>> regard
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Lynne Langton
>> > >>>
>> > >>> ________________________________
>> > >>> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > >>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> > >>> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> > >>> Subject: drawing research
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Is this pedantic or old
>> > >>>
>> > >>> please have a look
>> > >>>
>> > >>> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> > metabolism
>> > >>> anywhere.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> > >>> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> > >>> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> > >>>
>> > >>> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> > >>> as teens...
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Once again i do not try to judge
>> > >>> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> > >>> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> > >>> Don't you see the objet...
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Just compare viewing
>> > >>> arcadian landscapes
>> > >>> to
>> > >>> doggy streets...
>> > >>>
>> > >>>
>> > >>>
>> > >>> ________________________________
>> > >>> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> > protège
>> > >>> gratuitement !
>> > >
>> > > ________________________________
>> > > Envie de naviguer sur Internet sans laisser de trace? La solution
>> > avec
>> > > Internet Explorer 8
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 19:03:18 +0000
>> > From: greig burgoyne <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> >
>> > does this need to be sent to everyone..?
>> >
>> >
>> > --- On Wed, 5/5/10, ana leonor rodrigues
>> > <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> > From: ana leonor rodrigues <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>> > Date: Wednesday, 5 May, 2010, 19:09
>> >
>> >
>> > Dear Sylvia, and dear all
>> > Well, dogs are nice creatures, it’s true they defecate a lot around
>> > the urban environments, but it is part of life, like graffiti or
>> > homeless beings, unbearable things in grades.
>> > None of them exit inside arcadean landscapes, but give me the warmth
>> > of beings, the screams of the walls, the struggle of life, which I’d
>> > rather have to the hygienic and boring arcadean landscapes.
>> > It’s true that people are very different, that is what makes life
>> > fascinating.
>> > Ana Leonor
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > 2010/5/5, Venantius J Pinto <[log in to unmask]>:
>> > > Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All—
>> > > A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> > > different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with ones
>> > > environmental constructs — relationship with people and place;
>> which
>> > > then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones group,
>> > > philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> > slights
>> > > and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> > further
>> > > and further away in terms of various manners of distancing (near
>> and
>> > > far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> > elegance.
>> > > From the Self to the World.
>> > >
>> > > Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of Goan
>> > > parents. As with most people we too different in appearances as
>> also
>> > > the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> > > seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> > villages,
>> > > etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> > India,
>> > > see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> > > students at F.I.T. many years ago — see me not only as an Indian
>> > > standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> > make,
>> > > the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> > >
>> > > Then there is the the other Seeing — how the non-Indian sees the
>> > > Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> > > distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> > > individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we begin
>> to
>> > > get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport often
>> > makes
>> > > travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> > > bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> > > officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> > counties.
>> > >
>> > > I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of it.
>> > If I
>> > > am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> > something
>> > > which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing — I am hardly given the
>> > time
>> > > of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> > thoughts,
>> > > ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change, have
>> > more
>> > > fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you — give you
>> > > gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path;
>> Damian
>> > > Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not and
>> > they
>> > > are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my
>> right).
>> > > Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make decisions
>> on
>> > > their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even
>> things
>> > > like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is one
>> > > strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep going.
>> > As I
>> > > ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> > >
>> > > Besides, and its not a joke — it would take the work of the
>> **latter
>> > > to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill,
>> but
>> > > will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> > > levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common
>> sense.
>> > >
>> > > In appreciation,
>> > > venantius j pinto
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> > > <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > >> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about
>> > it i do
>> > >> not
>> > >> understand i feel the world is full of interesting
>> > things places
>> > >> art for example the German Expressionist show in Leicester
>> > Briget
>> > >> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when
>> > i began
>> > >> on
>> > >> this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> everyone
>> > >> instead
>> > >> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed me
>> > so i guess
>> > >> i
>> > >> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try
>> > and i am
>> > >> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so
>> > chooses with
>> > >> regard
>> > >>
>> > >> Lynne Langton
>> > >>
>> > >> ________________________________
>> > >> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > >> To: [log in to unmask]
>> > >> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> > >> Subject: drawing research
>> > >>
>> > >> Is this pedantic or old
>> > >>
>> > >> please have a look
>> > >>
>> > >> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> > metabolism
>> > >> anywhere.
>> > >>
>> > >> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of thinking
>> > >> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> > >>
>> > >> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> > >> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> > >>
>> > >> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> > >> as teens...
>> > >>
>> > >> Once again i do not try to judge
>> > >> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> > >>
>> > >> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> > >> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> > >>
>> > >> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> > >> Don't you see the objet...
>> > >>
>> > >> Just compare viewing
>> > >> arcadian landscapes
>> > >> to
>> > >> doggy streets...
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> ________________________________
>> > >> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> > protège
>> > >> gratuitement !
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Ana Leonor M. Madeira Rodrigues
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 22:25:00 +0200
>> > From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> >
>> >
>> > Dear All Dear Venantius
>> > pls no need to apology aren't we all " open minded " and trying
>> > toopen brains and views also as educators as Artist are opinion
>> > leaders...
>> > as Steve said : aren't we a community kind ofwho tryes to exchange
>> > views on facts related to
>> > DRAWING RESEARCH
>> > the logical proposal expressed as
>> > WORD = IMAGE = OBJECT
>> > SLANG WORD = WHICH IMAGE & WHICH OBJECT IN THE " SPACE " OF SPEECH
>> > AND THOUGHTSthus without judging but asking to which mental level /
>> > age / maturation spirit this may refer to
>> > EDUCATED WORDS = WHICH IMAGE & WHICH OBJECTS IN THE " SPACE " OF
>> > SPEECH AND THOUGHTS
>> >
>> > is a logical intersting question to be debated
>> > and many various disciplines may get linked to this proposal
>> > thanks for attentionbest
>> > :)
>> >
>> > > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 14:38:45 -0400
>> > > From: [log in to unmask]
>> > > Subject: Re: drawing research
>> > > To: [log in to unmask]
>> > >
>> > > Hi Sylvia—
>> > > My apologies. I understood the topic but was presenting an
>> > > extrapolated analogy.
>> > >
>> > > Again my sincere apologies. In future I will stay within the
>> > confines
>> > > of the thoughts presented.
>> > >
>> > > venantius j pinto
>> > >
>> > > On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 2:03 PM, sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > wrote:
>> > >> Hi Venantius Hi All
>> > >> thanks for your very interesting message.
>> > >> getting to know other cultures is a marvellous gift of life our
>> > societies
>> > >> allows.
>> > >> Frogive me my english is not so well written : as a french :)
>> > >> The topic is whether
>> > >> language should be elegant and possibly with no mistakes
>> > >> I just suggested to compare :
>> > >> an arcadian landscape ( used as a symbol of beautiful language )
>> > >> and
>> > >> a doggy street ( used as a symbol of some vernacular language
>> > people use)
>> > >> That was the purpose of up education...
>> > >> My purpose was not to judge people nor art...
>> > >> Just try people to " view " that sometime
>> > >> words also represent objects...
>> > >> By the way i really appreciate Bridget Riley
>> > >> and also Sol le Witt as a mathematician in arts :)
>> > >> thanks and best
>> > >> Sylvia CORNET
>> > >>> Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 13:33:52 -0400
>> > >>> From: [log in to unmask]
>> > >>> Subject: Re: drawing research
>> > >>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Hi Lynne, Hi Sylvia, Hi All—
>> > >>> A few thoughts for what they are worth: Individuals have very
>> > >>> different concerns, and this is dictated to some degree with
>> ones
>> > >>> environmental constructs — relationship with people and place;
>> > which
>> > >>> then opens up to include the immediate outside (out of ones
>> group,
>> > >>> philosophies, day-to-day realities, including those perceived
>> > slights
>> > >>> and true joys); later widening the ambit in seeing those even
>> > further
>> > >>> and further away in terms of various manners of distancing
>> > (near and
>> > >>> far) whether they be attitudes, levels of politeness, élan,
>> > elegance.
>> > >>> From the Self to the World.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Now a bit about me: I am of Indian origin, born in Mumbai of
>> Goan
>> > >>> parents. As with most people we too different in appearances
>> as
>> > also
>> > >>> the way Indians see one another across a range of categories. So
>> > >>> seeing is complex in various individuals, groups, clumps of
>> > villages,
>> > >>> etc. The way a true cosmopolitan Indian see the world outside
>> > India,
>> > >>> see the outside world in India is layered too. I used to tell my
>> > >>> students at F.I.T. many years ago — see me not only as an Indian
>> > >>> standing in front of you. Listen to what I say, the analogies I
>> > make,
>> > >>> the thoughts I put out, the idioms I use.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Then there is the the other Seeing — how the non-Indian sees the
>> > >>> Indian they encounter whether in India or outside India, The
>> > >>> distinctions needless to say would be many; dovetail that with
>> > >>> individual biases, comprehensions, cultural imprints and we
>> > begin to
>> > >>> get a glimpse of our complex faculties. My Indian passport
>> > often makes
>> > >>> travel a bit difficult for me. That may just be the nature of
>> > >>> bureaucracy or individual attitudes on part of the Immigration
>> > >>> officers I encounter. But I am not going to blame individual
>> > counties.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> I know where I stand in Drawing, but do not make a hoo-hah of
>> > it. If I
>> > >>> am invited I show up; keep doing my thing. But I have learnt
>> > something
>> > >>> which to me is helpful, and a bit amusing — I am hardly given
>> > the time
>> > >>> of day by those same people who are very reasonable in their
>> > thoughts,
>> > >>> ideas, lived aesthetics. In time they too will/ may change,
>> > have more
>> > >>> fulfilling experiences. Drawing can do that to you — give you
>> > >>> gravitas. From time to time someone opens or point to a path;
>> > Damian
>> > >>> Fennell and Steve Garner being two via DRN. Others** did not
>> > and they
>> > >>> are individuals to reckon with (Note: I am not saying its my
>> > right).
>> > >>> Although one is not being boorish or banal, people make
>> > decisions on
>> > >>> their perceptions and presumably if interests coincide. Even
>> > things
>> > >>> like whether you are cool/ appear Cool, plays a part. That is
>> one
>> > >>> strand in modernity, and we have to accept that, but keep
>> > going. As I
>> > >>> ready my self for some large works I keep this in mind.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> Besides, and its not a joke — it would take the work of the
>> > **latter
>> > >>> to another level for sure. We are not all equal in sheer skill,
>> > but
>> > >>> will gain or achieve very different things and on/ at different
>> > >>> levels. And this is not arrogance. Its obvious, and is common
>> > sense.
>> > >>>
>> > >>> In appreciation,
>> > >>> venantius j pinto
>> > >>>
>> > >>> On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 12:38 PM, lynne langton
>> > >>> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > >>>> bonjour i have read what you have written and thought about
>> > it i do
>> > >>>> not
>> > >>>> understand i feel the world is full of interesting
>> > things places
>> > >>>> art for example the German Expressionist show in Leicester
>> > Briget
>> > >>>> RILEY in Birmingham and so on the rudeness of people when
>> > i began
>> > >>>> on
>> > >>>> this site was primarily from England as i emailing
>> > everyone
>> > >>>> instead
>> > >>>> of the individual people in Europe were ploite and emailed
>> > me so i
>> > >>>> guess i
>> > >>>> am not into streets of dog poo but Cezanne and try
>> > and i am
>> > >>>> polite and it is okay to be pedantic if anyone so
>> > chooses with
>> > >>>> regard
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Lynne Langton
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> ________________________________
>> > >>>> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> > >>>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> > >>>> Sent: Tuesday, 4 May, 2010 18:34:59
>> > >>>> Subject: drawing research
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Is this pedantic or old
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> please have a look
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> You walk in a pleasant street and then a dog has applied his
>> > metabolism
>> > >>>> anywhere.
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Sentences are the same. Beautiful words and elegance of
>> thinking
>> > >>>> are as flowers in well kept meadows.
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> But of course everyone knows " teens " enjoy bad talkings.
>> > >>>> When this teens are concerned this is their level
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> But how feel right when a society has everybody talking
>> > >>>> as teens...
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Once again i do not try to judge
>> > >>>> but to apply a thinking of the Art History.
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Magritte drawed a pipe and wrote this is not a pipe.
>> > >>>> Of course this was a representation of a pipe.
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Thus if you " see " the words in your mind...
>> > >>>> Don't you see the objet...
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Just compare viewing
>> > >>>> arcadian landscapes
>> > >>>> to
>> > >>>> doggy streets...
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> ________________________________
>> > >>>> Acheter en ligne en toute sécurité ? Internet Explorer 8 vous
>> > protège
>> > >>>> gratuitement !
>> > >>
>> > >> ________________________________
>> > >> Envie de naviguer sur Internet sans laisser de trace? La
>> > solution avec
>> > >> Internet Explorer 8
>> >
>> > _________________________________________________________________
>> > Découvrez comment SURFER DISCRETEMENT sur un site de rencontres !
>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/FRM/go/206608211/direct/01/
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > Date: Wed, 5 May 2010 22:13:17 +0100
>> > From: Maria João Durão
>> > <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Subject: Re: TRACEY Call for Papers - Deadline
>> >
>> > Dear Deborah Harty,
>> >
>> > I am professor of drawing at the Lisbon Faculty of Architecture. It
>> > happens that I am also a researcher in the Space Architect Committee
>> > of the AIAA American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics
>> > www.fa.utl.pt
>> > www.spacearchitect.org
>> >
>> > where Im presently developing a VIRTUAL project based on an older
>> idea
>> > that dealt with the interior of the Destiny module of the
>> > International Space Centre, with digital means. My experience is
>> with
>> > hand sketching but virtual technologies are a completely diferent
>> tool
>> > altogether and does not implicate with hand drawing in any sense,
>> > according to my experience. In weightless space this technology
>> allows
>> > one to "see" the world from angles only possible in 0 -micro
>> gravity.
>> >
>> > I intended to send you a paper dealing with this topic by the 23rd
>> > May, but hve just realized that it is the 23rd April.
>> > I am sending you some material for you to analyse in case you are
>> > interested in publishing my work, somewhere . The abstract I am
>> > sending you is just a way to inform about the nature of the virtual
>> > experience and the just sufficient to carry the message.
>> > Please be free to contact me for further information.
>> > Kind regards,
>> > Maria Joao Durao
>> >
>> >
>> > Quoting Deborah Harty <[log in to unmask]>:
>> >
>> > > The deadline for TRACEY's latest call for papers is 23rd April
>> 2010.
>> > > Please see below for details.
>> > >
>> > > Tracey is a peer reviewed electronic journal dedicated to drawing
>> > > and contemporary issues. It is varied and diverse with a fast
>> > > growing readership of academics, students and practitioners
>> > > representing a wide range of drawing interests including fine art,
>> > > architectural design, graphics, product design and visual
>> > > communication, ideally any activity in which drawing is essential.
>> > >
>> > > You can see us at http://www.lboro.ac.uk/departments/ac/tracey/
>> > index.html
>> > >
>> > > In this next invitation for submissions, we are focusing on the
>> > > theme of Drawing & Technology, particularly in relation to the
>> > > following questions:
>> > >
>> > > Where are the masterpieces of digital drawing?
>> > >
>> > > Does digital drawing dissolve the Albertian Window?
>> > >
>> > > Does digital drawing dissolve the boundaries between author and
>> > viewer?
>> > >
>> > > Digital collaboration in drawing â what are the opportunities?
>> > >
>> > > Motion capture as pencil in a virtual space?
>> > >
>> > > How does drawing in the third and fourth dimension challenge our
>> > > traditional practices?
>> > >
>> > > Can computational modelling advance our understanding of drawing
>> > processes?
>> > >
>> > > What are the benefits of having an intelligent assistant?
>> > >
>> > > Does e-paper change anything?
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > A submission may constitute drawings or other visual material,
>> texts
>> > > or research papers that have not been published before or have
>> been
>> > > published in a different context and also texts and images
>> > > combined. There is no word or image limit at this stage.
>> > >
>> > > All submissions will be peer reviewed by two members of the peer
>> > > review panel. Please visit the site to view our guidelines for
>> > > submissions and a list of our peer reviewers.
>> > > Submissions should be accompanied by a summary of content and
>> > > italics should be highlighted in colour. If text includes images,
>> > > send images also as separate jpegs. Submissions should be on disc
>> > > (Zip or CD and 300 dpi) or as attachments in MS Word with
>> > > pictures/images separate as jpegs (72dpi). Send to
>> > > [log in to unmask] or c/o Deborah Harty, Loughborough
>> University,
>> > > School of Art & Design, Epinal Way, Loughborough, Leicestershire
>> > > UK, LE11 3TU no later than the 23rd April 2010.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > Deborah Harty
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ----------------------------------------------------------------
>> > This message was sent using IMP, the Internet Messaging Program.
>> >
>> > ------------------------------
>> >
>> > End of DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010 (#2010-78)
>> > ********************************************************************
>> >
>> > Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. Get it now.
>> >
>> >
>> > Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.
>> > Sign up now.
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 18:31:33 +0200
>> From: sylvia cornet <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: NIGHT OF MUSEUMS // MAY 15 TH NATIONAL ARCHIVES MUSEUM IN
>> PARIS THEMA : THE UNIVERSA EXHIBITIONS... La Nuit des Musées aux
>> Archives nationales, le 15 mai
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Le samedi 15 mai 2010, de 14 h à 1 h du matin, c'est la
>> "Nuit des Musées" aux Archives nationales, 60 rue des
>> Francs-Bourgeois,
>> 75003 Paris.
>>
>> Visites, jeux, ateliers pour enfants, conférences, concert de musique
>> classique, présentation de documents et exposition vous attendent...
>> sur le thème, notamment, des expositions universelles.
>>
>> Tous renseignements sur le site des Archives nationales.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Christiane Demeulenaere-Douyère
>>
>> Conservateur général du patrimoine
>>
>> Section du XIXe siècle
>>
>> Direction scientifique du site de Paris
>>
>> Archives nationales
>>
>> 60 rue des Francs-Bourgeois
>>
>> 75141 Paris Cedex 03
>>
>> Tél : 01 40 27 62 94
>>
>> Télécopie :01 40 27 66 47
>>
>> Exotiques expositions...
>>
>> Les expositions universelles
>>
>> et les cultures extra-européennes.
>>
>> France, 1855-1937
>>
>>
>> Archives nationales
>>
>> 60 rue des Francs-Bourgeois
>>
>> 75003 Paris
>> 31 mars - 28 juin 2010
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Envie de naviguer sur Internet sans laisser de trace? La solution
>> avec Internet Explorer 8
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Consultez vos emails Orange, Gmail, Yahoo!, Free ... directement
>> depuis HOTMAIL !
>> http://www.windowslive.fr/hotmail/agregation/
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 16:39:55 -0400
>> From: Rachel Clark <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: Research not chat!
>>
>> I seem to be getting far too many emails which are socio-chat and not
>> related to research.
>> Please therefore unsubscribe me
>> Many thanks
>> Rowena Payne AND I SECOND THAT
>> THANK YOU
>> RACHEL CLARK
>> On May 6, 2010, at 11:35 AM, Rowena Payne wrote:
>>
>> > I seem to be getting far too many emails which are socio-chat and
>> > not related to research.
>> > Please therefore unsubscribe me
>> > Many thanks
>> > Rowena Payne
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 21:00:47 +0000
>> From: J BERRY <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: Research not chat!
>>
>> me too
>> jo berry-please unscribe me
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: Rachel Clark <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: [log in to unmask]
>> Sent: Thursday, 6 May, 2010 21:39:55
>> Subject: Re: Research not chat!
>>
>>
>> I seem to be getting far too many emails which are socio-chat and not
>> related to research.
>> Please therefore unsubscribe me
>> Many thanks
>> Rowena Payne AND I SECOND THAT
>> THANK YOU
>> RACHEL CLARK
>> On May 6, 2010, at 11:35 AM, Rowena Payne wrote:
>>
>> I seem to be getting far too many emails which are socio-chat and not
>> related to research.
>>
>> -----------------------------
>>
>> End of DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 6 May 2010 (#2010-81)
>> ******************************************************
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Fri, 7 May 2010 12:38:22 +0100
>> From: Christine Turner <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 4 May 2010 to 5 May 2010
>> (#2010-78)
>>
>> > Hi,
>>
>> > Integrity in my practice is defined by sound method that can
>> > consistently and discerningly unify visual ideas and explorations.
>> > With such integrity, more slippery philosophic concepts such as
>> > realism for
>>
>> > example, can be examined and 'integrated' into the process.
>>
>> I'll email some work.
>> Thanks
>> Chris.
>>
>> On 7 May 2010, at 07:10, Jac Saorsa wrote:
>>
>> > Hi Chris
>> > You wrote; 'Perhaps this points to the extended possibilities of
>> > drawing as communication i.e the 'process' is greater than an
>> > individual piece of work?'
>> >
>> > Yes...I think you have a very sound point. I hope that others may
>> > want to follow up with this as I think that the concept of process,
>> > albeit not necessarily new, is nevertheless also a very productive
>> > line of discussion. I am also very interested in 'integrity' and
>> > wonder how you would define this.
>> > Good luck with you exploration ...is any of your work online? I
>> > would be interested to see it.
>> > Best wishes to all
>> > Jac
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.
>> > Sign up now.
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Date: Fri, 7 May 2010 10:51:34 -0500
>> From: Lesa Moriarity <[log in to unmask]>
>> Subject: Re: Research not chat!
>>
>> I agree with Eduardo. This list is terrific with respect to 'chats',
>> the
>> subject line is the indication. Delete them right away and carry on.
>> Very
>> little 'chatting' happens on this list.. so I don't mind it when it
>> happens.
>>
>> Sorry that people are choosing to leave over some rare chatting. We
>> will
>> miss you.
>>
>> Lesa.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > Dear Rowena,
>> > I'm afraid you will have to do it yourself in the JISC Mail website.
>> > I think that news, discussions, proposals on drawing in general are
>> > within the general theme of the List.
>> > I think that the duty of making this list a real debate list on
>> drawing
>> > research is up to the contributors.
>> > It is up to us the ones interested in research to came up with
>> research
>> > stuff and make it the overwhelming majority of the posts and ignore
>> what
>> > they consider to be chats.
>> > Best,
>> > Eduardo Corte-Real
>> > Dr Arch. Ass. Prof. IADE, Lisbon
>> >
>> >
>> > On 06-05-2010 16:18, Rowena Payne wrote:
>> >> I seem to be getting far too many emails which are socio-chat and
>> not
>> >> related to research.
>> >> Please therefore unsubscribe me
>> >> Many thanks
>> >> Rowena Payne
>> >>
>> >
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> End of DRAWING-RESEARCH Digest - 6 May 2010 to 7 May 2010 (#2010-82)
>> ********************************************************************
|
