out of Cambridge indeed!
i do hear rumours that it's started to become human.
2009/7/15 Max Richards <[log in to unmask]>
> An old colleague of mine, out of Cambridge but no simple leavisian, when
> Shelley
> was mentioned, would crumple and emote:
>
> I fall upon the thorns of life! I bleed!
>
> The devaluations of both Milton and Shelley that I recall were often
> focussed
> very scrupulously on their diction.
>
> William Empson was not on the right.
>
> Just random first comments, excuse scrappiness.
>
> in haste,
> Max
>
> Quoting David Bircumshaw <[log in to unmask]>:
>
> > As a critic/teacher Davie hada very interesting career: from being a
> > supporter of Larkin he became a mentor of Tom Raworth, if I remember
> > correctly. He did write a short poem in his The Shires sequence which
> > mentions the Leicester Poetry Society at mention ing which people's
> interest
> > will perk, unfortunately I have to wince inwardly when mentioning it to
> > advertise the group as the poem's also little more than doggerel.
> >
> > The problem with 20th century evaluations of Milton and Shelley in
> > particular is disentangling critiques of elements of their diction with
> the
> > fact that both were political poets and of their time precursors of the
> > modern left while their arch-detractors like Pound and Eliot (explicitly)
> > and Leavis (implicitly) were very much of the right wing. I'd hasten to
> add
> > that I don't know what Leavis's actual political affiliations were, but
> his
> > nostalgic harking back to the organic village is as conservative
> as,say,the
> > avowedly anti-democrat Catholic Tolkein.
> >
> > 2009/7/14 Max Richards <[log in to unmask]>
> >
> > > I think Davie was hard at work in academic English widening the canon
> that
> > > had
> > > been narrowed by Leavis's Revaluation (1936), which was so hard on
> Shelley
> > > and
> > > Milton and ...
> > >
> > > Whatever Davie's achievement as poet, his criticism wherever I have
> sampled
> > > it
> > > has an energy and often relish about it that engages me ...
> > >
> > > Max
> > >
> > > Quoting David Bircumshaw <[log in to unmask]>:
> > >
> > > > I never did read it when young and it has been a pleasure to do so
> now,
> > > I've
> > > > also looked back at a lot of Shelley that I did find exciting when 14
> and
> > > am
> > > > rather thrilled that I can still feel those pinions beating in, say,
> the
> > > > Hymn to Intellectual Beauty. It's as valid of its age as Beethoven
> > > sonatas
> > > > or the slightly later Chopin. I can almost feel wooden ships at
> anchor,
> > > hear
> > > > their timbers creaking.
> > > >
> > > > Yes, Julian and Maddalo does have a calmer voice in the narrator, its
> > > rather
> > > > like a foretaste of Clough there, with the more Gothic and wilder
> Shelley
> > > in
> > > > the voice of the madman. it's very kind of as puny a poet as Donald
> Davie
> > > to
> > > > condescend to pat him on the head.
> > > >
> > > > 2009/7/9 Max Richards <[log in to unmask]>
> > > >
> > > > > Thanks for both, Robin.
> > > > >
> > > > > My wife is rapt; she has printed out the whole poem, and says it
> speaks
> > > to
> > > > > her
> > > > > even more than her favourite Wordsworth passages.
> > > > > She says she twisted her ankle part way through the Romantic poets
> > > course
> > > > > twenty
> > > > > years ago, and missed Shelley altogether!
> > > > > I recall Donald Davie long ago ('Purity of Diction...') made a case
> for
> > > a
> > > > > levelheaded rather than rhapsodic Shelley on the strength of
> 'Julian
> > > and
> > > > > Maddalo'. But I guess it remains on the unread or under-read side
> of
> > > > > Shelley.
> > > > >
> > > > > Max
> > > > >
> > > > > Quoting Robin Hamilton <[log in to unmask]>:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Specifically:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Most wretched men
> > > > > > Are cradled into poetry by wrong:
> > > > > > They learn in suffering what they teach in song.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Shelley, "Julian and Maddalo", Line 544.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Robin
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > "... in the preface to the collection [Elizabeth Barrett
> > > (Browning)]
> > > > > > > insisted on the sorrow and suffering necessary to the poet, and
> she
> > > > > quoted
> > > > > > > from Shelley's 'Julian and Maddalo' to clinch her argument that
> 'we
> > > > > learn
> > > > > > > in suffering what we teach in song.' ... "
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > This email was sent from Netspace Webmail:
> http://www.netspace.net.au
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > David Bircumshaw
> > > > "A window./Big enough to hold screams/
> > > > You say are poems" - DMeltzer
> > > > Website and A Chide's Alphabet
> > > > http://www.staplednapkin.org.uk
> > > > The Animal Subsides
> http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
> > > > Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------
> > > This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > David Bircumshaw
> > "A window./Big enough to hold screams/
> > You say are poems" - DMeltzer
> > Website and A Chide's Alphabet
> > http://www.staplednapkin.org.uk
> > The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
> > Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> This email was sent from Netspace Webmail: http://www.netspace.net.au
>
--
David Bircumshaw
"A window./Big enough to hold screams/
You say are poems" - DMeltzer
Website and A Chide's Alphabet
http://www.staplednapkin.org.uk
The Animal Subsides http://www.arrowheadpress.co.uk/books/animal.html
Leicester Poetry Society: http://www.poetryleicester.co.uk
|