It gets worse, Mark. You've also been turned down by the ICA (Irish
Countrywoman's Association)
best
Randolph
Mark Weiss wrote:
> Oh my god I've blown my cover. I knew there was a reason the CIA
> turned down my application.
>
> At 04:01 PM 6/1/2009, you wrote:
>> It ain't tacit anymore.
>>
>> Hal
>>
>> "My experience is what I agree to attend to."
>> --William James
>>
>> Halvard Johnson
>> ================
>> [log in to unmask]
>> http://sites.google.com/site/halvardjohnson/Home
>> http://entropyandme.blogspot.com
>> http://imageswithoutwords.blogspot.com
>> http://www.hamiltonstone.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jun 1, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Mark Weiss <[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > My practice: I don't consider web publication as the same category
>> as print
>> > publication, so I just submit. Someday someone may complain. Till
>> then,
>> > that's my tacit decision.
>> >
>> > Mark
>> >
>> >
>> > At 11:24 AM 6/1/2009, you wrote:
>> >
>> >> The whole issue of whether print media poetry editors consider
>> various
>> >> forms of on line appearance to be "previous publication" is very
>> >> confused, and in general editors have done little to clarify it.
>> >> Most submission guidelines simply specify "previously unpublished."
>> >> But there's no common sense or generally accepted answer to whether
>> >> "previously published" includes internet publication, since there's
>> >> no common sense or generally accepted definition of what "internet
>> >> publication" is. For instance, a poem might appear on the internet:
>> >>
>> >> 1) in an email sent by the poet to an individual
>> >>
>> >> 2) in an email sent to an email dist list maintained on the poet's
>> email
>> >> account
>> >>
>> >> 3) in an email sent to a centrally maintained email dist list
>> which is
>> >> not archived anywhere
>> >>
>> >> 4) in an email sent to a centrally maintained email dist list the
>> >> archive of which is only available to registered members
>> >>
>> >> 5) in an email sent to a centrally maintained email dist list, the
>> >> archive of which is not indexed by Google but is available to anyone
>> >> who knows where to look for it (like poetryetc)
>> >>
>> >> 6) in an email sent to a centrally maintained email dist list, the
>> >> archive of which is indexed by Google so that anyone can find the
>> poem
>> >> by a Google author or title search
>> >>
>> >> 7) on an internet poetry web site where anyone can post their poems
>> >> (like poemhunter.com, which is a particularly good example of the
>> >> uncertainty, since that site has characteristics of both an on line
>> >> anthology and an on line workshop)
>> >>
>> >> 8) on the poet's own personal web site
>> >>
>> >> 9) on someone else's hobbyist literary web site
>> >>
>> >> 10) on a formally edited on line poetry magazine web site unconnected
>> >> with any print magazine
>> >>
>> >> 11) on the web site of a print magazine (while not being included in
>> >> the print version)
>> >>
>> >> 12) on a web site of any one of the types mentioned above that was
>> >> taken off line five years ago, so that the poem is no longer
>> available
>> >> on the internet
>> >>
>> >> 13) any combination of the above
>> >>
>> >> 14) other situations I haven't thought of
>> >>
>> >> Which of the above constitute "previous publication on the internet?"
>> >> Almost no one, I think, would include 1) or 2), almost everyone
>> >> would include 10) and 11), and there would varying degrees of
>> >> disagreement about the rest.
>> >>
>> >> If you ask print media poetry editors about this, they will usually
>> >> just say glibly, "If it's on the internet, it's been published,"
>> >> because that's the easy answer to a messy question and since they get
>> >> so many poems anyway, they're glad to have one more category to
>> >> summarily weed out. This means that poets who want to submit poems
>> >> to print journals need to keep those poems off the internet while
>> they
>> >> are being considered by those print journals; and since response
>> times
>> >> are typically measured in months, and many poems are only finally
>> >> accepted for publication after being submitted to a series of print
>> >> journals, this could easily mean keeping them off the internet for a
>> >> year or more.
>> >>
>> >> I suspect many poets either tacitly follow their private definitions
>> >> of what constitutes "internet publication" when submitting to print
>> >> media -- "the guidelines say 'no previous publication' and this has
>> >> been on poemhunter but I don't have to mention that because that's
>> not
>> >> really publication" -- or else look on this issue as one more reason
>> >> not to deal with the humiliating gauntlet of "submission" (what a
>> >> wonderfully albeit unconsciously apt word for it!) to print journals
>> >> and to just put everything on the internet themselves in the first
>> >> place.
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> ===============================================
>> >>
>> >> Jon Corelis http://jcorelis.googlepages.com/joncorelis
>> >>
>> >> ===============================================
>> >>
>> >
>
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