JiscMail Logo
Email discussion lists for the UK Education and Research communities

Help for SIDNEY-SPENSER Archives


SIDNEY-SPENSER Archives

SIDNEY-SPENSER Archives


SIDNEY-SPENSER@JISCMAIL.AC.UK


View:

Message:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Topic:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

By Author:

[

First

|

Previous

|

Next

|

Last

]

Font:

Proportional Font

LISTSERV Archives

LISTSERV Archives

SIDNEY-SPENSER Home

SIDNEY-SPENSER Home

SIDNEY-SPENSER  July 2008

SIDNEY-SPENSER July 2008

Options

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Subscribe or Unsubscribe

Log In

Log In

Get Password

Get Password

Subject:

Re: The Virgilian Tradition

From:

"James C. Nohrnberg" <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Sidney-Spenser Discussion List <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:08:09 -0400

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (150 lines)

In a relatively uninflected language, meaning, word-order and implicit 
word-compounds (temporarily achieved by contiguity) determine what goes with 
what, or takes what as its subject, object, modifier, conjugate, etc.

English "infinitives" get split for the sake of meaning and nuance and the
cadence of thought or expression; it is a question of the balance of
implication, the rationing (or flow) of information, the weight and 
comparison of
emphasis, the perceived immediacy of the need to promptly or pre-emptively
define one word by another, and the proximity or integration of ideas.

[[ "To give generously from(of) one's limited funds" is not quite the same
as "to generously give of(from) one's limited funds" --the latter example
could be construed, by a strict or legalistic constructionist, as excluding
other forms of donation (such as "of/from one's stock of time"), and only
targeting one's money, while the former example seems slightly more
inclusive and presumptive.  A more costly adverb, "sacrificially," would
probably obliterate the difference between (1) emphasizing (i.e., putting up
front) the form or way the giving is to take (second case: "to generously
give"), and (2) presuming the generosity to be more or less inherent in or
integral to the giving itself (first case: putting the form that the giving 
is to
take after the giving itself:  "to give generously"). If you think the
adverb and the verb should be more closely integrated than the verb and its
inflection, or that the "how/when/where" comes first and deserves priority,
you will tend to split the infinitive. You might, ordinarily, not want to
go there, i.e., to there go, for naturalness is all.  Yet the old order 
changeth, and every
"mistake" counts as an innovation, and nurtures a new nature.  Perhaps
Americans are nowadays tending to put the "how/when/where" first, more
often than the English.]]


On Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:35:30 -0400
  David Miller <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> I prefer not to split them, in general.  I will always be grateful to  W. 
>K. Wimsatt for sending his undergrad students to Fowler's articles  on 
>selected errors--false parallelism will always be my favorite, but  they 
>were all wonderful.
> 
> I think of split infinitives as part of a larger issue:  word order in 
> prose.  I guess the secrets of word order are a lost art in much  academic 
>writing, but maybe there never was a golden age.  In any  case, my own 
>impression is that word order (is that what Eliot meant  when he praised 
>Donne's "ordonnance"?) belongs among the finishing  touches of a good style.
> 
> 
> On Jul 22, 2008, at 9:44 PM, Tom Bishop wrote:
> 
>> The Wikipedia entry on the split infinitive is very informative and  
>> full, both on the history of the construction and of the prohibition  
>> against it.
>>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split_infinitive
>>
>> Tom
>>
>> On 23/07/2008, at 1:42 PM, Margaret Christian wrote:
>>
>>> Good heavens, Richard, what are you talking about?
>>>
>>> The very first person to make a dent in my blissful unconsciousness  
>>> of split vs. intact infinitives was Gordon Kipling at UCLA in 1981  
>>> or 1982; I was in my second year of graduate school.  My honest  
>>> reaction to all the red on my paper:  "Huh?"  And this despite my  
>>> learning [and adoring] to diagram sentences in fifth grade and  
>>> every subsequent year through eighth grade, at least.
>>>
>>> I still never notice on my own, and always take comfort in the  
>>> fantasy that the rule against splitting infinitives must be one of  
>>> those imported from another language's grammar, like the rule  
>>> against ending sentences with a preposition.  Did the rule come  
>>> from somewhere identifiable?
>>>
>>> Margaret
>>>
>>> At 02:37 PM 7/22/2008 +0100, [log in to unmask] wrote:
>>>> Any prizes for spotting the split infinitive or is that just a  
>>>> Fowlerian
>>>> piece of pedantry?
>>>>
>>>> Best wishes,
>>>>
>>>> Richard
>>>>
>>>>  On 7/22/08, *andrew zurcher* <[log in to unmask]
>>>> > <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >     I can't get the url to work... Any thoughts, or is this just  
>>>> a blip?
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > That's no blip, it's a blunder!* The correct URL is
>>>> > http://virgiliantradition.org. Content still forthcoming...
>>>> >
>>>> > * "That's no moon, it's a space station!" Reechy kisses at the  
>>>> Argante
>>>> > Kissing Booth for the first five-thousand scholars to correctly  
>>>> identify
>>>> > this quotation without using Google.
>>>> >
>>>> > --
>>>> > Dr. David Wilson-Okamura    http://virgil.org          [log in to unmask]
>>>> > <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
>>>> > English Department          Virgil reception, discussion,  
>>>> documents, &c
>>>> > East Carolina University    Sparsa et neglecta coegi. -- Claude  
>>>> Fauchet
>>>> >
>>>
>>> Margaret R. Christian, Ph.D. 
>>>                                   [log in to unmask]
>>> Associate Professor of English                          Office:  
>>> (610) 285-5106
>>> Penn State Lehigh Valley                                         
>>> Home:  (610) 562-0163
>>> 8380 Mohr Lane                                          fax: (610)  
>>> 285-5220
>>> Fogelsville, PA   18051   USA http://www.lv.psu.edu/professional/ 
>>> mrc1/
>>
>> Tom Bishop
>> Professor and Head of English
>> University of Auckland
>> (64-9) 373-7599 ext 85586
>>
>> [log in to unmask]
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 
> David Lee Miller
> Professor of English and
>   Comparative Literature
> University of South Carolina
> Columbia, SC 29208
> (803) 777-4256
> [log in to unmask]
> 
> 
> 

[log in to unmask]
James Nohrnberg
Dept. of English, Bryan Hall 219
Univ. of Virginia
P.O Box 400121
Charlottesville, VA 22904-4121

Top of Message | Previous Page | Permalink

JiscMail Tools


RSS Feeds and Sharing


Advanced Options


Archives

May 2024
April 2024
March 2024
February 2024
January 2024
December 2023
November 2023
October 2023
September 2023
August 2023
July 2023
June 2023
May 2023
April 2023
March 2023
February 2023
January 2023
December 2022
November 2022
October 2022
September 2022
August 2022
July 2022
June 2022
May 2022
April 2022
March 2022
February 2022
January 2022
December 2021
November 2021
October 2021
September 2021
August 2021
July 2021
June 2021
May 2021
April 2021
March 2021
February 2021
January 2021
December 2020
November 2020
October 2020
September 2020
August 2020
July 2020
June 2020
May 2020
April 2020
March 2020
February 2020
January 2020
December 2019
November 2019
October 2019
September 2019
August 2019
July 2019
June 2019
May 2019
April 2019
March 2019
February 2019
December 2018
November 2018
October 2018
September 2018
August 2018
July 2018
June 2018
May 2018
April 2018
March 2018
February 2018
January 2018
December 2017
November 2017
October 2017
September 2017
August 2017
July 2017
June 2017
May 2017
April 2017
March 2017
February 2017
January 2017
December 2016
November 2016
October 2016
September 2016
August 2016
July 2016
June 2016
May 2016
April 2016
March 2016
February 2016
January 2016
December 2015
November 2015
October 2015
September 2015
August 2015
July 2015
June 2015
May 2015
April 2015
March 2015
February 2015
January 2015
December 2014
November 2014
October 2014
September 2014
August 2014
July 2014
June 2014
May 2014
April 2014
March 2014
February 2014
January 2014
December 2013
November 2013
October 2013
September 2013
August 2013
July 2013
June 2013
May 2013
April 2013
March 2013
February 2013
January 2013
December 2012
November 2012
October 2012
September 2012
August 2012
July 2012
June 2012
May 2012
April 2012
March 2012
February 2012
January 2012
December 2011
November 2011
October 2011
September 2011
August 2011
July 2011
June 2011
May 2011
April 2011
March 2011
February 2011
January 2011
December 2010
November 2010
October 2010
September 2010
August 2010
July 2010
June 2010
May 2010
April 2010
March 2010
February 2010
January 2010
December 2009
November 2009
October 2009
September 2009
August 2009
July 2009
June 2009
May 2009
April 2009
March 2009
February 2009
January 2009
December 2008
November 2008
October 2008
September 2008
August 2008
July 2008
June 2008
May 2008
April 2008
March 2008
February 2008
January 2008
December 2007
November 2007
October 2007
September 2007
August 2007
July 2007
June 2007
May 2007
April 2007
March 2007
February 2007
January 2007
December 2006
November 2006
October 2006
September 2006
August 2006
July 2006
June 2006
May 2006
April 2006
March 2006
February 2006
January 2006
December 2005
November 2005
October 2005
September 2005
August 2005
July 2005
June 2005
May 2005
April 2005
March 2005
February 2005
January 2005
December 2004
November 2004
October 2004
September 2004
August 2004
July 2004
June 2004
May 2004
April 2004
March 2004
February 2004
January 2004
December 2003
November 2003
October 2003
September 2003
August 2003
July 2003
June 2003
May 2003
April 2003
March 2003
February 2003
January 2003
December 2002
November 2002
October 2002
September 2002
August 2002
July 2002
June 2002
May 2002
April 2002
March 2002
February 2002
January 2002
December 2001
November 2001
October 2001
September 2001
August 2001
July 2001
June 2001
May 2001
April 2001
March 2001
February 2001
January 2001
December 2000
November 2000
October 2000
September 2000
August 2000
July 2000
June 2000
May 2000
April 2000
March 2000
February 2000
January 2000


JiscMail is a Jisc service.

View our service policies at https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/policyandsecurity/ and Jisc's privacy policy at https://www.jisc.ac.uk/website/privacy-notice

For help and support help@jisc.ac.uk

Secured by F-Secure Anti-Virus CataList Email List Search Powered by the LISTSERV Email List Manager