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FSL  July 2008

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Subject:

Re: a) Second level FEAT, b) 2 EV´s w ith same time course

From:

Tim Behrens <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

FSL - FMRIB's Software Library <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Wed, 9 Jul 2008 09:31:10 +0100

Content-Type:

text/plain

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>

Hi


> I have 2 questions regarding FEAT analysis.
>
> a) I have a situation where in study of 12 subjects I want to  
> compare 2
> modeling strategies (with and without single trial psychophysiological
> information). When modeled entirely seperately using the quantitative
> information (3rd column in 3-column log file containing  
> physiological data
> instead of fixed stimulus intensity) does not give "more"  
> activation in any
> of the 12 subjects. However, in the group level analysis, all of a  
> sudden
> the model containing psychophysiological information gives more (also
> reasonable) activation, but only in the mixed effects flame.
>

It is because
1) the pp information is now accounting for some relevant information  
that was previously being assigned to your cope of interest -  
therefore the cope of interest is more likely to reflect the same  
thing across subjects.
2) The pp information accounts for new information that was  
previously regarded as noise, so that when you take it up to the  
group level, the 1st level variances are smaller, and more suitably  
balanced across subjects.


> How is that possible?
>
> b) I want to compare these 2 models more directly, asking which one  
> is more
> informative or even, what is the quantitative information adding to  
> the
> "regular" model. What is the way to go? Contrasting seems to give
> unreasonable results. Orthogonalisation? If itīs orthogonalisation how
> should it be set up? Again: I have to identical time courses with and
> without quantitative information in the 3 column of the custom  
> logfile.
>

This is exactly what you have already done, by including the pp to  
complete with your effect of interest. The fact that your effect fo  
interest has changed significantly due to the pp information tells  
you that the pp information can account for variance in the FMRI data.

Do not orthogonalise - you want to let the two regressors compete to  
explain the signal.


You can tell how much ambiguity there is between the two signals, by
i) correlating them
ii) looking at the deisgn efficiency in 1st level feat - if you need  
a ridiculous signal change (>3%?) to detect your effect, then  
probably the regressors are ambiguous.



If you want to go further, an F-test at the first level in each  
subject can tell you whether your pp is significantly reducing the  
variance, but, from what you have told us, it almost certainly is -
It very much sounds to me as though including the pp is the right  
thing to do.

T





> Thanks!
>
> Arian
>
>
>

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