I suppose in this instance, tho, there was a parallel between the two
situations. Our team knew about this company and some of its abusive
practices but they weren't made clear to potential customers before they
signed on the line. I think craig was asking whether if we had known
about a water company polluting water (but perhaps local communities
didn't) would we have done something more than we did?
I'm doing the next level of my vulnerable adults training at the
beginning of next year, so I will raise this with them, along with the
issue of domestic violence (are wo/men who disclose that they are
involved in a violent relationship considered to be 'vulnerable
adults'?).
suzanne
Suzanne Elliott
Clinical Psychologist
Treatment & Recovery Services
Swithland House (CTT East)
London Rd
Leicester
LE2 2PL
0116 225 5600
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: The UK Community Psychology Discussion List
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of McGowan John
(Sussex Partnership Trust)
Sent: 07 November 2007 13:06
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: 'direct action' against poverty?
A interesting point in here because actually loan-sharking is not
necessarily the equivalent of polluting water. In the former case one
might argue that people have a choice and a measure of personal
responsibility that can be exercised. A company polluting water is a
very different matter in that we may not know anything about it. I'd
actually be quite worried about equating the two as it leads
professionals into a position of quite extreme paternailsm and social
control (albeit with people's best interests in mind). I would guess
that some of these factors may have come into play in
Protection of vulnerable adults does (or should) at least ask us to
think about striking a balance between peoples rights and
responsibilities and to make judgements about things like capacity
before diving in. I think the thing about being fairly light-handed and
non-paternalistic about such matters is that people will go on
extercising their right to associate with unsuitable people, recklessly
borrow money, take harmful substances etc. How annoying is that! If only
they'd just do what we say it all would be alright...
Naming and shaming is tempting though one might obviously risk action
(possible legal) from a loan company themselves who may or may not
actually be breaking the law. As a long term Peter Tatchell fan I admire
naming and shaming (and the sheer guts of the way its sometimes done)
but always worth a slight pause for thought first.
Very much enjoy the list incidentally.
Dr John McGowan
Lead Psychologist (Acute Services)
Sussex Partnership Trust
Tel: 07970 554 189
Please note that I normally work in the Trust Mondays to Thursdays
-----Original Message-----
From: The UK Community Psychology Discussion List
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Suzanne Elliott
Sent: 07 November 2007 11:52
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: 'direct action' against poverty?
Yes. I would name the company, but I can't remember now. I know we
'named and shamed' at the time, but as I said that was on an individual
level, rather than community. Vulnerable adults procedures would have
been really useful here, but as far as I could see the whole community
was 'vulnerable' to their tactics and I think we as a team could have
worked harder with community groups to raise the profile, critique and
take action about what was happening.
Suzanne
Suzanne Elliott
Clinical Psychologist
Treatment & Recovery Services
Swithland House (CTT East)
London Rd
Leicester
LE2 2PL
0116 225 5600
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: The UK Community Psychology Discussion List
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Craig Newnes
Sent: 06 November 2007 16:44
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: 'direct action' against poverty?
So, let's get this straight, you spent time "wondering" what to do while
more people got ripped off. Now you are looking for ideas but don't want
to
do the obvious. If you knew a company was polluting a local water supply
you
would warn the community by naming the company. The community might then
take community action. Is loan sharking not the equivalent?
C
----- Original Message -----
From: "Suzanne Elliott" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [COMMUNITYPSYCHUK] 'direct action' against poverty?
hi craig
er... no thanks.
:o)
suzanne
________________________________
From: The UK Community Psychology Discussion List on behalf of Craig
Newnes
Sent: Tue 06/11/2007 12:25
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: 'direct action' against poverty?
Name and shame
C
----- Original Message -----
From: Suzanne Elliott <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask]
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 10:01 AM
Subject: Re: [COMMUNITYPSYCHUK] 'direct action' against poverty?
When I was working in the west midlands a couple of years ago, the cmht
in
which I was based became aware that one of those 'loan shark' companies
were
extremely active, perhaps even targeting, a few of the neighbourhoods
where
people who used our service tended to be housed. We really felt like we
wanted to do something about this, as many people were being taken
advantage
of through high pressure direct marketing techniques and 35%+ interest
rates
on loans. However, I'm ashamed to admit that nothing came of this
'wanting
to do something' and I wondered whether, should I come across this
again,
anybody on the list had ideas about 'direct action'? Although
individual
workers in the team took up issues on an individual basis with the
company
on behalf of the individual service user they worked with, I'm wondering
whether there was anything we could have done at a 'community' level?
suzanne
Suzanne Elliott
Clinical Psychologist
Treatment & Recovery Services
Swithland House (CTT East)
London Rd
Leicester
LE2 2PL
0116 225 5600
E-mail: [log in to unmask]
-----Original Message-----
From: The UK Community Psychology Discussion List
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of Horrocks Matthew
Sent: 31 October 2007 15:27
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: 'direct action' against poverty?
Thanks for your posting John,
Whilst rightly pointing out that people could strive to remain mindful
of
areas where we might collude with unhelpful concepts, marginilisation,
etc.
I do think that there is tremendous positive value in your suggestion,
and I
for one would appreciate as many practical tips as possible from list
members about helping people (including myself) to navigate the mire of
social oppression in all its forms.
Apologies if my wording here isn't as clear and precise as others might
be -
I'm in a rush against the clock today and I also feel demonstrably
inarticulate compared to many of you good people on this list, and some
of
the recent postings.
Having said that, best wishes to you all and keep up the good work,
there
have been some really interesting and useful developments shared here of
late.
Cheers,
Matthew.
________________________________
From: The UK Community Psychology Discussion List
[mailto:[log in to unmask]] On Behalf Of John Cromby
Sent: 31 October 2007 14:21
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: [COMMUNITYPSYCHUK] 'direct action' against poverty?
I think the statement is good and am happy to be associated with it if
that's appropriate.
I also wonder if list members might be able to do more to combat
poverty. In
fact I suspect that some at least already are, but that it might be
useful
to share 'good practice' in this respect.
An example: a friend of mine works in benefit advice. One of her clients
was
being made homeless because she lost her job after being diagnosed with
depression, and so had fallen behind on her mortgage repayments. She
tried
to claim for this on her mortgage repayment protection insurance, but
was
shocked to find out that she wasn't covered because the policy would
only
pay out in cases of 'mental illness' where people are 'under the direct
care
of a consultant psychiatrist' or some such wording.
My friend asked me about this, and I spoke to supportive psychiatrist
that I
know. He confirmed that the numbers of people 'under direct care' in
this
way are vanishingly small, and provided some relevant figures to back
this
up. Armed with these figures and some more info on prevalence and
service
delivery, my friend tackled the insurance company and made a veiled
threat
to publicise a policy wording which effectively excludes almost all
possible
claims. She accompanied this with a letter, kindly supplied by another
psychiatrist, who In response to this they immediately offered an ex
gratia
'no liability' payment to her client that was sufficient to cover the
mortgage arrears.
I'm sure people on the list have taken similar small initiatives. So
what
I'm suggesting is not so much that we share these kinds of stories; more
that we share any resources, advice or tactics that were generated. For
example, I can ask my friend to provide anonymised copies of the letters
to
the insurance company; where appropriate, these could be then used as
templates by others.
I realise such initiatives are not without their paradoxes: this one,
for
example, involved a degree of collusion with an individualising
psychiatric
diagnosis. Personally, I see no contradiction between taking such action
tactically, to help people facing immediate problems, whilst
strategically
and publicly continuing to challenge individualising scientifically and
morally bankrupt ideas and practices; but I do realise that others may
well
feel differently.
J.
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