his poetry does haunt, because the arhcaism & the apocalypsis have a
tone & even a subject matter that defies, to an extent, consciousness
of understanding. defies "life".
though in this poem I do see a final tremble away from the aloof into
down-to-earth pity, but even that is a loftier kind: "After the first
death there is no other". the first death paralyzes, weighs all
importance, imperfectly & unrealistically.
KS
On 23/08/07, joe green <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Never until the mankind making
> Bird beast and flower
> Fathering and all humbling darkness
> Tells with silence the last light breaking
> And the still hour
> Is come of the sea tumbling in harness
>
> And I must enter again the round
> Zion of the water bead
> And the synagogue of the ear of corn
> Shall I let pray the shadow of a sound
> Or sow my salt seed
> In the least valley of sackcloth to mourn
>
> The majesty and burning of the child's death.
> I shall not murder
> The mankind of her going with a grave truth
> Nor blaspheme down the stations of the breath
> With any further
> Elegy of innocence and youth.
>
> Deep with the first dead lies London's daughter,
> Robed in the long friends,
> The grains beyond age, the dark veins of her mother,
> Secret by the unmourning water
> Of the riding Thames.
> After the first death, there is no other.
>
>
> So what do you do with this? The suspicion is that it is easy -- great rhetoric -- a "refusal" to mourn and then what? But it is very strange. Not modern -- and not anything else either. Seems "modern" in the sense that the Zion doesn't prevail -- may be a nothing, not even a hope. But is isn't anything else either. For just that reason. No solace in a common humanity -- no generalization or a taking up into something beyond death. So, for me, if I can move beyond the attachment of the poem to Dylan Thomas and all of the whatever attached to that, this poem is a poem just because it refuses everything. Has a unique existence and one that haunts me.
>
> Roger Day <[log in to unmask]> wrote: Still, definitely a retreat from modernity.
>
> Roger
>
> On 8/23/07, kasper salonen wrote:
> > ... he'd consider IT less ...
> >
> > On 23/08/07, kasper salonen wrote:
> > > I think he'd consider less a retreat from life & more a delving,
> > > diving into life at its most metaphysical. no less 'real', he & some
> > > would feel, than any hunchback in the park
> > >
> > > KS
> > >
> > > On 22/08/07, Roger Day wrote:
> > > > I actually love the lyricism and the way he uses language. It sings to
> > > > me as no other poetry, and it's the archaism, the tone and his word
> > > > usage that does this to me, but I cannot hide from the fact that the
> > > > content is almost a full scale retreat from modernity, from life.
> > > > Which I suppose is one way of dealing with the violence of his time.
> > > >
> > > > Roger
> > > >
> > > > On 8/22/07, kasper salonen wrote:
> > > > > I don't mind the hint of archaism. it's still fresh & attacking &
> > > > > rumbling & wonderful to me. if being 'modern' means relinquishing the
> > > > > kind of tone possible with Dylan's type oflanguage, I don't think I
> > > > > care to be modern. at least not all the time
> > > > >
> > > > > KS
> > > > >
> > > > > On 21/08/07, Roger Day wrote:
> > > > > > If you want to stay away from the 20th century, yeah, Dylan's yr man.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Roger
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 8/21/07, kasper salonen wrote:
> > > > > > > another utterly humbling place to go for language recycled & built
> > > > > > > into visions is Dylan Thomas
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > KS
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On 20/08/07, Douglas Barbour wrote:
> > > > > > > > Intriguing take, Tad. bpNichol once made the same point, saying, if
> > > > > > > > your nouns & verbs need support, they're not doing the proper work, or
> > > > > > > > words to that effect.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I found the range of poets you've written about intriguing, wide, &
> > > > > > > > often opposing....
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Doug
> > > > > > > > On 19-Aug-07, at 12:06 PM, TheOldMole wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > And you may want to start rethinking if your poem starts to be
> > > > > > > > > modifier-driven. I've actually written something on this, which you
> > > > > > > > > may find totally useless, but it's on my website at
> > > > > > > > > http://www.opus40.org/tadrichards/essays.html under "Tired Words -
> > > > > > > > > Working Words."
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Douglas Barbour
> > > > > > > > 11655 - 72 Avenue NW
> > > > > > > > Edmonton Ab T6G 0B9
> > > > > > > > (780) 436 3320
> > > > > > > > http://www.ualberta.ca/~dbarbour/
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Latest book: Continuations (with Sheila E Murphy)
> > > > > > > > http://www.uap.ualberta.ca/UAP.asp?LID=41&bookID=664
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Every time Dick Cheney smiles
> > > > > > > > an angel in heaven
> > > > > > > > gets waterboarded.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Jon Stewart
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
> > > > > > "In peace, sons bury their fathers. In war, fathers bury their sons."
> > > > > > Roman Proverb
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
> > > > "In peace, sons bury their fathers. In war, fathers bury their sons."
> > > > Roman Proverb
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
>
> --
> My Stuff: http://www.badstep.net/
> "In peace, sons bury their fathers. In war, fathers bury their sons."
> Roman Proverb
>
>
>
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