Hello Rosemary
 
Would you use the same arguments to say that there was no need to train teachers of kindergarten, elementary, primary, secondary, or university  ages separately?  Ie one teacher training for all, given that there are complexities everywhere?  Or have I missed the point?
 
The list arose because I asked people to comment on what characteristics, if any, might influence the way older people learn in comparison with younger adults.  Obviously, most of the characteristics in the current list [with the exception of having greater experience] could apply to learners of any age.  But in answering the question, we would  surely be assuming that these were likelihoods, not invariant traits.
 
Anita 
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From: Discussion of mature learning for leisure, health, or work on behalf of Rosemary Westwell
Sent: Sat 25/08/2007 14:19
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Mature learning - list of factors - questioning the list per se


I think I must live on a different planet. 
Why, I ask, are we endeavouring to classify older learners as different learners to younger ones?  Isn't the world made up of unique individuals who are all different and one of these differences is age?
 
Taking the current list:
Older people are described as more complex:
In what way? My youngest daughter at the age of 13 was one of the most complex individuals I have met. Her complexities were extensive and, it could be argued more extensive than mine. 
It could also be argued that her 'experience' was wider than mine had been at her age and, her experience (witnessing her father slowly decline into insanity certainly gave her a wider experience than I ever had in this way).  She has completed a linguistics degree and is now studying nursing - both 'experiences' I have not enjoyed. 
'Stronger' is a difficult word to accept - physically in certain areas, I am weaker than I was - but stronger in others. I may appear to have more confidence but that is a matter of personality - some youngsters can be very, if not 'over' confident. 
We may appear to be slower - in our thought patterns for example, but some of the remedial classes I taught contained students who were far, far slower than any older individual I have met. 
As students at school I am sure we were just as reflective as we can be when we are older. I remember to this day inspiring teachers who led us through 'real' A levels where we were encouraged to think and reflect on our own experiences and beliefs.
To say we have 'developed personal learning styles' is to assume that we have finished learning. As Tom so rightly points out - this is far from the case - as individuals in this ever changing world we are learning all the time. We are always 'developing learning styles' and surely we are changing and adapting these to suit the different issues and contexts we come across. 
You do not have to be old to be selective - some of the students I teach at EFL schools are extremely selective about aspects of the material I am teaching they decide to focus on. 
Stubborn - have you talked to a two-year old lately?
 
Sorry to keep trying to put a spoke in the wheel, but isn't this whole exercise an excuse to try to make out that we oldies are 'better' and more knowledgeable than the younger generation?  How do we know this for a fact, when we are not part of this younger generation? Aren't we all members of one human race in which older and younger people differ - some wiser, more experienced, more complex ..etc. than others? Aren't there times when we oldies appear to be more knowledgeable and experienced than the younger generation in SOME matters but aren't the younger generation more knowledgeable and experienced in OTHERS? (I am regularly seeking advice on a variety of matters from my other daughter, for example).
 
Rosemary Westwell 


ANITA PINCAS <[log in to unmask]> wrote: 

	Hi,
	
	As our list grows, it would be best if you could add your 1-2 word contribution to the list, and send the new list in just as a list.  
	
	Then , if you feel it is necessary, you can give an explanation of your contribution in a separate message with your new term in the subject header. That was we can get a growing list going.
	
	Here is the latest for you to copy and add to.
	
	Factors that might distinguish older from younger adult learners
	
	Older learners are likely to be/have:
	
	·         more complex, 
	·         more variable in their complexities 
	·         wider experience 
	·         stronger though slower [because so much more experience gets brought into it] 
	·         reflective 
	·         developed personal learning styles
	·         critical
	·         confident/self-assured
	·         selective as learners
	·         stubborn ["ornery"]
	
	
	It would be nice if others jump in and add to the list.
	
	Anita
	




Dr.R.J.Westwell (PhD, MA Ed, MA TESOL, BMus, BA Hons) may also be contacted: telephone /answerphone UK +44 (0)1353 663918 

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