Thanks very much for your very constructive input, Pam. The postgrad fee 
option for low/un-waged seems very reasonable to me, but I am only 
speaking for myself. I will certainly bring the issue up when the entire 
committee meets.

Additionally, the main problem we are noticing is postgrads and 
non-students/academics, who can actually afford the lowest conference 
fees, still cannot attend because of travel and lodging costs. This most 
distressing matter is one I hope can be at least mitigated in future 
(fund raising and grant writing is not something in which I excel, 
though). Any ideas or information on this would be great.

saed

Pamela Shurmer-Smith wrote:
> This is a very useful reply, thank your Salvatore.  I'm less excited 
> by Hillary's bracketing unwaged people along with feudal peasantry, 
> but I'm sure it was well intentioned.  What I really meant was that 
> many conferences allow low-paid and unwaged people to  pay the 
> postgrad fee.  As to proving one's status and freeloading, I'm naive 
> enough to assume that people who define themselves as "critical" don't 
> cheat radical initiatives and we need to exercise an element of trust.
>
> By the way, this wasn't personal - I've earned (just) enough this year 
> to regard myself as obliged to pay the full fees; but being on the 
> outside gives one a different viewpoint.
>
> Pam
>
> */Salvatore Engel-DiMauro <[log in to unmask]>/* wrote:
>
>     Dear all,
>
>     This is a most welcome critique, Pam, and so is the suggestion below,
>     Hillary. As one of the conference organisers, I too find
>     difficulty with
>     this issue, along with the rest of the organisers. We will be
>     discussing
>     this matter at length for the sake of future conferences. We are,
>     however, trying to accommodate low-wage and even unwaged
>     non-academics
>     as best we can, given no monetary resources at all except our
>     individual
>     pocket books and some minimal funding sources from two or three
>     institutions.
>
>     In my view, part of the problem is also ensuring that people that
>     receive low wages or unemployment welfare in, say, Kigali, are not
>     treated as if they had the same income as a low wage or unemployed
>     in,
>     say, New York City. Affiliation and academic status is one way to
>     verify
>     and differentiate income level, but it is clearly not sufficient, nor
>     necessarily justifiable (some might also find our
>     geographically-based
>     fee-differentiation problematic, too). However, given the exiguous
>     resources at our disposal, it certainly helps us as organisers to
>     have
>     those problematic academically-centred categories in place and make
>     exceptions as the need arises. The point, in the end, is to
>     redistribute
>     received funds in such a way as to be able to help those with much
>     lesser economic means.
>
>     But I feel obliged here as well to counter assumptions about what
>     constitutes "costs" and "abuse". Unlike mainstream academic
>     associations
>     (RGS, AAG, etc.), we are actually very few, unpaid, and overworked
>     with
>     logistics. So, costs may be marginal if only counted in conventional
>     terms, as money/assets (and even those kinds of costs are hardly
>     marginal to us!); they are certainly not marginal in terms of time we
>     devote to organising the event (and when necessary a bit of our
>     personal
>     dosh). The matter of potential "abuse" is inapplicable here, since
>     the
>     conference is already "uneconomic" in mainstream economic terms. In a
>     context of an often murderously abusive global system based on
>     surplus
>     extraction to benefit the few, the least we can do is to have
>     those that
>     have more economic means contribute more for the benefit of those
>     with
>     less. I would be more worried about the sort of abuse Hillary
>     describes
>     in a context of economic equality.
>
>     I hope this clarifies the problem we are facing as organisers and
>     more
>     such constructive critiques and suggestions are certainly welcome.
>
>     saed
>
>     Dr Hillary Shaw wrote:
>     > I totally agree.
>     >
>     > What are the marginal costs of an extra person at a conference -
>     > surely pretty low, especially if no food is provided. Even if they
>     > get a conference schedule, the marginal cost of printing an
>     extra few
>     > can't be large, and they usually print a few extra to make sure all
>     > paying delegates have one anyway.
>     >
>     > Of course if loads of 'low paid / unwaged' turned up, or many waged
>     > abused this, the whole thing would become uneconomic.
>     >
>     > Maybe conferences could adopt a policy of - once the paying list is
>     > full - having a few places, limited in number, for the first few
>     > 'unwaged / low waged' applicants free. Say up to 5% or 10% of the
>     > total conference paid places. A bit like the ancient idea of
>     gleaning
>     > fields, leaving the edges of your field unharvested, so the poor
>     didnt
>     > have the indignity of begging.
>     >
>     > Dr Hillary J. Shaw
>     > Business Management and Marketing Group
>     > Harper Adams University College
>     > Shrewsbury Road
>     > Newport, Shropshire
>     > TF10 8NB
>     > www.fooddeserts.org
>     >
>     > In a message dated 15/08/2007 16:06:53 GMT Daylight Time,
>     > [log in to unmask] writes:
>     >
>     > Has anyone else wondered why the fees charged for the Mumbai
>     > conference assume that everyone is either Faculty or Postgrad,
>     > with no provision for low-paid or unwaged? Given that both
>     > Faculty & Postgraduates are liable to be able to shift all or part
>     > of their fees, travel and subsistence onto their departments,
>     > whereas unwaged people have to find the whole sum themselves, it
>     > seems a bit thoughtless to assume that all non-students can afford
>     > to come at the higher rate. I tried writing to one of the
>     > organisers back in April, they said they'd think about it ...
>     >
>     > Pam Shurmer-Smith
>     >
>     >
>     > Pamela Shurmer-Smith
>     > Portsmouth
>     > UK
>     >
>     >
>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>     > For ideas on reducing your carbon footprint visit Yahoo! For Good
>     > this month.
>     >
>     >
>     >
>
>     -- 
>     Salvatore Engel-Di Mauro
>     Department of Geography, SUNY New Paltz
>     1 Hawk Drive, New Paltz, NY 12561
>     tel: 1/845/2572991, fax: 1/845/2572992
>     e-mail: [log in to unmask]
>
>     Senior Editor
>     Capitalism Nature Socialism: A Journal of Ecosocialism
>
>     Editor
>     ACME: An international e-journal for critical geographies
>     http://www.acme-journal.org/
>
>
>
>
> Pamela Shurmer-Smith
> Portsmouth
> UK
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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-- 
Salvatore Engel-Di Mauro
Department of Geography, SUNY New Paltz
1 Hawk Drive, New Paltz, NY 12561
tel: 1/845/2572991, fax: 1/845/2572992
e-mail: [log in to unmask]

Senior Editor
Capitalism Nature Socialism: A Journal of Ecosocialism

Editor
ACME: An international e-journal for critical geographies
http://www.acme-journal.org/