I'm changing subject heading as it's overlapping slightly.  In answer to
Ian's assertion (if that's not too macho for you Ian!!)  below. I couldn't
disagree with you more Ian - I say even more assertively!  I think the links
between America and Canada (which is in flowering by the minute) and Britain
has never been stronger nor more varied. Relatively cheap air flights are
one factor.  Even three decades ago I had to save for weeks for coach to
London.  America! In your wildest dreams. Almost all the journals and
anthologies I've been in over the last ten or more years are American or
Canadian (I'll just put N. American from hereon.for shorthand).

Your list below is true enough but how small and how boy centric!  And
that's the thing.  Because we (well me not you) know so many more poets
there isn't a little select band anymore and with your one woman short list
below I'm rather glad it's not the case.  O.K. let's just redress the
balance and mention some of the wonderful N.American gels out and about and
doing all this stuff you don't know about:  Catherine 'Fecking Fab' Wagner ,
Susan Howe (she is be one of our greatest and most inventive poets - she's
just knock out), oh and not forgetting Fanny Howe and then the stunning work
Lisa Robertson, o.k. now I'll just list some without comment, Hannah Weiner,
Joan Retallack, Leslie Scalapino, Kathleen Frazer, Nicole Brossard, Lyn
Hejinian, Meredith Quartermain, Catherine Daly .. must I go on....  I'm not
a fifth of the way through.  I don't like all these poets work because there
all so very different - some to my great liking others not.  But is this
relevant to your statement. And these are only the gels!

So my sweet Ian - get out your nostalgia loop and make your OWN American
connections.  I mean there's so much on offer you can just form your own
little top list.  I think my problem with your problem is that the it's
almost a 'given' list of golden oldies - make your own!  We can now.  It's
called democracy and the web and cheap travel have enabled that more than
anything. The gods and one goddess is not given anymore and its not enough
for me!  We can have our own private Love List.  Isn't this good?  Rejoice!
I say with my handbag at the ready.

Mission Statement from Monk!
Make A You're Own Love List.
Don't Have It Made For You.

Toots
G.


>, despite all the technology for communicating and on-line mags etc, the
>gulf between poetry in the states and poetry in the UK/Europe is wider than
>ever. I certainly feel less in touch with US stuff than I did 10 or 20
>years ago. Interesting to think it was only 4 or 5 decades back that the
>fight was to get US literature accepted in British Universities. That
>transatlantic histroy, the links between Olson, Dorn, Prynne, Raworth,
>Berrigan, Harwood, Notley, Ashbery etc don't seem to be there in the same
>way, although I think Raworth still reads pretty regularly in the states.
>
> Ian
>
>
>
>
>>From: mIEKAL aND <[log in to unmask]>
>>Reply-To: mIEKAL aND <[log in to unmask]>
>>To: [log in to unmask]
>>Subject: Re: Why the English have staked the claim for Martian Poetry
>>Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2006 10:28:52 -0600
>>
>>I guess I  must be an ignorant oaf...  I had never even heard of  Craig
>>Raine, or Martian Poetry as a movement invented by a couple of  Brits.
>>The Martian Poetry that I've encountered over the years is  much more
>>connected to glossolalia, invented language, linguistics,  spiritualism,
>>'pataphysics & speculative fiction.  The few examples  that I've seen of
>>Raine's iteration of Martian Poetry seems insulting  to Martians
>>everywhere.
>>
>>~mIEKAL
>>
>>On Jan 18, 2006, at 10:04 AM, Jane Holland' wrote:
>>
>>>  Indeed, this whole thread is bizarre.
>>>How could anyone not know that Craig Raine invented Martian  poetry?! He
>>>hasn't done much
>>>since, let's face it!
>