Dear David and Karl,
I am (and will) look for all possibilities. The final goal is to provide the
best tool for my users.
We have to keep in mind that my users are PhD students (90%) and research
assistants with fixed term contract. They do not have time to expend with
software, or anything else than HEP. It is their chance to do an outstanding
work that will open doors in their lifes.
I will keep in touch.
James
>From: Karl Harrison <[log in to unmask]>
>Reply-To: Karl Harrison <[log in to unmask]>
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: Provoking?
>Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2005 11:20:33 +0100
>
>Dear David,
>
> I just mention that James has agreed to have another look at Ganga
>after the next release (later this week), which will include LCG
>submission.
>
> I apreciate what James says about the needs for flexibility, and
>fitting in with what users do already, which were among the main
>motivations for the Ganga redesign. Ganga at this point *is* a
>framework, which should be able to take relevant parts of EasyGrid
>as a BaBar-specific extension, and hopefully add some useful features
>for free.
>
> Anyway, I'll be in touch with James when we make the next
>release and we'll see how things go from there.
>
>Best wishes, Karl.
>
>p.s. Sorry to have taken this thread a bit off topic.
>
>=========================================================================
>
>On Mon, 5 Sep 2005, James Werner wrote:
>
> > Dear David,
> > I was working at Imperial with Janusz and I know his work.
> > The problem about develop software for BaBar is we have to provide at
>least
> > the same level of reliability, flexibility and functionality of SLAC.
>Years
> > ago users tried to use Alibabar and Ganga, it does not work and users
>went
> > back to slac.
> > The system must be in command line mode to allow integration with user's
> > scripts, it must be based in sequence number from bookkeeping metadatada
> > (never handlers), and it must provide a set of functions independently
>and not
> > be heavy.
> > In my point of view, users are quite good programming, and the approach
> > adopted in EasyGrid using a framework (like the experiment software) is
>the
> > best approach to achieve our requirements.
> > James
> >
> >
> >
> > > From: David Britton <[log in to unmask]>
> > > To: Karl Harrison <[log in to unmask]>
> > > CC: [log in to unmask], [log in to unmask]
> > > Subject: Re: Provoking?
> > > Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 09:49:21 -0400
> > >
> > > Dear Karl, James,
> > >
> > > A couple of years ago a Ganga front end to BaBar was provided by
>Janusz
> > > Martyniak at Imperial ([log in to unmask]). Janusz is
>still
> > > around (working on GridCC) so you could contact him for any insight. I
>don't
> > > know why this wasn't taken further but it is possible that it's time
>has now
> > > come (Ganga has come a long way design-wise; and BaBar have make great
> > > progress too)? Notionally, this would be a great way to proceed and
>would
> > > certainly qualify as a highlight success.
> > >
> > > Regards, Dave.
> > >
> > > Karl Harrison wrote:
> > >
> > > > Dear James,
> > > >
> > > > I found your web pages interesting, although it looks as if
>EasyGrid
> > > > is trying to the same as Ganga, but limited to BaBar. Ganga
>provides
> > > > a generic job definition/submission framework, into which
> > > > extensions specific to a particular experiment/user are easily
>added.
> > > > The EasyGrid instructions contain a lot of "in file x change lines y
>to
> > > > z", which wouldn't be needed in Ganga, where configurable parameters
>are
> > > > placed in evidence in application/backend schemas.
> > > >
> > > > Is there any chance of you having a look at Ganga
> > > > (http://ganga.web.cern.ch/ganga), to see if it's potentially useful
> > > > for BaBar? The most recent paper is the one submitted to AHM05:
> > > > http://ganga.web.cern.ch/ganga/documents/pdf/ganga_ahm05.pdf
> > > > or to try it out, you could have a look at:
> > > > http://ganga.web.cern.ch/ganga/user/v4/CLIP/
> > > > (I'm afraid that this only describes version 4.0.0-beta1, and for
> > > > LCG submission you'll need 4.0.0-beta3, to be released next week.)
> > > >
> > > > Best wishes,
> > > >
> > > > Karl.
> > > >
> > > >
>===========================================================================
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, 2 Sep 2005, James Werner wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Dear David,
> > > > > I would appreciate very much if you write in "Aplications/ 10
> > > > > Integration with
> > > > > running experiments" about my web page:
> > > > >
> > > > > HEP analysis, Grid and EasyGrid Job Submission Prototype:
>Babar/CM2
> > > > > showcase
> > > > > http://www.hep.man.ac.uk/u/jamwer/
> > > > >
> > > > > This page contains the development of EasyGrid (a job submission
>system
> > > > > for
> > > > > LCG) that has all necessary modules to do HEP analysis using grid.
>A
> > > > > babar
> > > > > software tutorial is also provided.
> > > > > EasyGrid especification is available at
> > > > > http://www.hep.man.ac.uk/u/jamwer/#sec9 and user manual at
> > > > > http://www.hep.man.ac.uk/u/jamwer/userman.html
> > > > >
> > > > > There are 3 benchmarks:
> > > > > 1. Discrimination of Pions and Kaons in the electromagnetic
>calorimeter:
> > > > > 18
> > > > > million events in 26 jobs, 10 jobs in parallel.
> > > > > 2. Pi 0 reconstruction: see
> > > > > http://www.hep.man.ac.uk/u/jamwer/pi0alg5.html
> > > > > for a very interesting analysis. 500 million events running in 200
>jobs
> > > > > in
> > > > > several sites (Manchester testbed, Manchester production, and
>RAL). I
> > > > > generated 6 million monte carlo eventsat Manchester production.
>The
> > > > > parametric
> > > > > model was Breit-Wigner invariant mass model.
> > > > > 3. Searching for deuterons: this project was a stress test for
>grid. see
> > > > > http://www.hep.man.ac.uk/u/jamwer/deutdesc.html
> > > > > The first run was 80 jobs with 20 million events each. The second
>was
> > > > > 800 jobs
> > > > > with 2 million events each.
> > > > >
> > > > > Grid evaluation can be found at
>http://www.hep.man.ac.uk/u/jamwer/#sec15
> > > > >
> > > > > Best regards,
> > > > > James
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > From: David Britton <[log in to unmask]>
> > > > > > Reply-To: David Britton <[log in to unmask]>
> > > > > > To: [log in to unmask]
> > > > > > Subject: Provoking?
> > > > > > Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:45:33 -0400
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Dear Colleagues,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > At the last Oversight Committee meeting, GridPP was asked to
>document
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > "Value added or Delivered by the Project". Although this seems
>like
> > > > > > another
> > > > > > piece of make-work, presumably its value is that it can be
>passed up
> > > > > > the
> > > > > > political food-chain and is an opportunity for us to define our
> > > > > > successes.
> > > > > > Of course, being at the bottom of the food-chain, it has landed
>on my
> > > > > > desk
> > > > > > or, more accurately, it appeared on the GridPP14 Programme
> > > > > > ( http://www.gridpp.ac.uk/gridpp14/programme.html ) with my name
> > > > > > attached as
> > > > > > "Provocateur". So, in order to provoke, I have pre-prepared (off
>the
> > > > > > top of
> > > > > > my head so to speak) a list of 22 possible key things that we
>might
> > > > > > document. They are available on the web linked from the relevant
>item
> > > > > > om the
> > > > > > GridPP14 programme, or at:
> > > > > >
>http://www.gridpp.ac.uk/pmb/ProjectManagement/GridPPAchievements.htm
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I think most members of GridPP will have an opinion about at
>least a
> > > > > > few
> > > > > > items that they would like to appear in such a list. Please feel
>free
> > > > > > to
> > > > > > contact me or to contribute during the GridPP14 session, if you
>feel
> > > > > > some
> > > > > > key item is missing. For items that are there, the next step is
>the
> > > > > > wording
> > > > > > (in most cases I have made a first attempt which you can see by
> > > > > > clicking on
> > > > > > the relevant item in the list). Again, I will be happy to
>receive
> > > > > > comments
> > > > > > and suggestions on the wording in advance or during the session.
>The
> > > > > > final
> > > > > > step will be to add tertiary information that backs up the
>higher
> > > > > > level
> > > > > > statements by referencing more specific items (such as code
>delivered
> > > > > > or
> > > > > > roles held etc).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Regards, Dave.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
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