Dear All,
Please find attached the weekly GridPP Project Management
Board Meeting minutes. The latest minutes can be found each week in:
http://www.gridpp.ac.uk/php/pmb/minutes.php?latest
as well as being listed with other minutes at
http://www.gridpp.ac.uk/php/pmb/minutes.php
Cheers, Tony
________________________________________________________________________
Tony Doyle, GridPP Project Leader Telephone: +44-141-330 5899
Rm 478, Kelvin Building Telefax: +44-141-330 5881
Dept of Physics and Astronomy EMail: [log in to unmask]
University of Glasgow Web: http://ppewww.ph.gla.ac.uk/~doyle
G12 8QQ, UK Video - IP: 194.36.1.32
________________________________________________________________________
GridPP PMB Minutes 171 - 16th May 2005
========================================
Present: Tony Doyle, John Gordon, Steve Lloyd, Robin Middleton & Dave Kelsey
by video.
Peter Clarke & Roger Jones by phone
Dave Britton, Sarah Pearce by Skype.
Apologies: Tony Cass, Jeremy Coles, Dan Tovey.
1. Dissemination Reports
========================
SP said that BP has put the latest version of the GridPP talk for schools
on the web at: http://www.gridpp.ac.uk/talks/schools_talk_vers4.ppt.
Comments should be sent to ([log in to unmask]) by next Monday please.
SP reported on the preparation for AHM and said there would not be any
talks as such on the stand, but there would be presentations on particular
themes to include Networking, Portals, Security Operations and Data
Management. Freebies on offer were headphones and a mouse. BP is
preparing an information pack and a background for stands.
JG said the bidding process for demo stands for Supercomputing would start
soon and close mid-June. It was likely that 3 projects would be
pre-allocated to EPSRC. It was likely that PPARC could have 2 demos
(GridPP and AstroGrid).
SP said that the JPhysG reviewers' comments had proposed publishing
chapters 3-5 online only, as they were less closely related to the
journal's remit. SP said that a summary chapter to cover these sections
was to be submitted, alongside the online sections. Therefore, SL will
provide a summary on Deployment, TD - middleware and SP - Management.
This is planned to be sent next week.
2. MSN Quarterly Reporting and Issue 05Q1 - Middleware
======================================================
As a general comment, there was not enough focus on deliverables
reporting. The logbooks will be modified to cover this directly.
Storage - Regarding the concerns re dCache, TD said a lot had been done on
this since the report. Particular concerns were raised on the dCache
deployment at Lancaster and Imperial - in readiness for SC3. A plan is
needed for the future interface to the ADS. CASTOR is being evaluated now.
JG said that the plan for Castor deployment needed to be publicised.
NEW ACTION: JG to communicate ADS-Castor planning from Dave Corney more
widely
Metadata - RM said reporting had been fine. However, he wished to
highlight the report from EGEE in Athens in which it was stated that
reported "Data management in different Grid middlewares and applications
is in a terrible state". TD said re-deploying people to cover more
general areas might help, but is not anticipated, and would certainly
compromise work on metadata. The PMB agreed that this should not be done.
WMS - RM said the effectiveness of joining the JRA1 testbed had to be
monitored. Work is going ahead on porting WMS over Sun Grid Engine and
this will also need integrating with APEL. A re-focussing of the WMS
support post is necessary as such work is not anticipated as their primary
function. Further discussion is needed with Imperial.
NEW ACTION: DB to ensure that SGE is not the priority for WLMS support.
The logbook will have to be revised to take the middleware support post
into account.
InfoMon - Maintenance of 3 code bases has proved difficult and is
ultimately unsustainable. RM discussed uptake by LHC experiments and said
CMS have been testing for monitoring using BOSS. A seminar on R-GMA by
Laurence Field will be held at CERN (and by VRVS) on 20th May to educate
people. Weekly meetings are taking place between R-GMA and SA1 people
which are proving very fruitful. JG and Steve Fisher will attend a meeting
at CERN later in the week on DGAS; its relation to APEL will also be
discussed.
Security - Issues or problems have not been highlighted in the report.
More information on deliverables is needed. The relationship with
EGEE-JRA3 is not given. It was hoped that these issues would be addressed
in the coming quarter with the appointment of two new people.
Networking - The relationship with UKERNA over UKLIGHT has been better
defined. The requirements for SC3 have been transmitted to UKERNA. Steve
Fisher is investigating differences in perceived directions of GridPP
w.r.t. EGEE-JRA4 on network monitoring and its use of R-GMA. Future
planning of service challenges is not clear.
LCG Deployment - There are a lot of important points being raised here.
Stephen Burke will be asked to present and discuss this at a future PMB
(at a time when JC can be present - since the issues are deployment
related).
NEW ACTION:- RM to ask Stephen Burke to present at future PMB
05Q1 Overview
=============
DB sent some notes highlighting areas of concern.
ISSUE-1: Slow filling of T1 and T2 posts - DB has been following this up.
ISSUE-2: Middleware quarterly reports tend not to comment directly on the
deliverables - He said that the Deliverables were not explicit enough but
on the other hand some of the Middleware reports had too much information.
RM said this was sometimes because the reports had to contain other
information needed for different purposes.
ISSUE-3: Quarterly reporting exercise was very late despite being
initiated 10 days before the end of quarter.
ISSUE-4: R-GMA uptake is weak (no experiments and competing LCG tools in
Data management area)
ISSUE-5: WLMS plans need re-vamping to account for SGE work - RM to follow
this up.
ISSUE-6: Ganga development seems to be slightly struggling and uptake is
weak? (RJ had left the meeting by this point and therefore was unable to
comment)
ISSUE-7: CMS level-2 deliverables seem to have got off to a slow start
which suggests a close watch should be kept on progress during this
quarter.
ISSUE-8: Babar programme needs clarification.
ISSUE-9: CDF work needs clarification.
ISSUE-10: Comments in LCG-Deployment quarterly report to be raised by RM.
TD said some of the issues were covered in the Actions list. An update
will be done on this by June, prior to the Oversight Committee meeting in
July.
ACTIONS
=======
157.2: RJ - review experiment computing models for Tier-1 to Tier-2
interactions in the UK.
ongoing
157.9: RM to report on direction of GridPP in terms of middleware.
ongoing
159.13: TC to extract LCG issues for GridPP13 talks
ongoing
159.14: RM to extract Middleware issues for GridPP13 talks
done - TD will circulate
159.19: DB to make a list of all GridPP people and their roles
ongoing - in progess- waiting for logbooks
167.2: JC, with input from Stephen Burke to maintain a list of middleware
issues that should be addressed
ongoing
167.3: RJ to define UK contacts for each experiment who will respond on
experiment operational issues.
ongoing
167.4 TD to discuss with RM revised funding policy for GridPP people
attending HEP SysMan meetings
done - HEP SysMan to be removed from Travel Policy such that GridPP people
will be supported to attend these.
167.5 DK to define a possible technical documentation role.
ongoing
167.8 RJ to raise CDF deliverables definition with Todd Huffmann.
ongoing
167.10 DB to chase up all unfilled GridPP posts at this point.
done
168.2: JC & AS to discuss and finalise production grid milestones &
metrics for Tier-1
done
170.1: JG to issue a URL to give advice for VO registration
done
170.2: RJ to invite to representatives to talk to the PMB about GANGA status
ongoing
170.3: DT to compile and issue a follow-up questionnaire to UB
ongoing
170.4: TD to speak to COD people about the sound delay in the system
ongoing
NEW ACTION 171.1: JG to communicate ADS-Castor planning from Dave Corney
more widely
NEW ACTION 171.2: DB to ensure that SGE is not the priority for WLMS
support
NEW ACTION 171.3: RM to ask Stephen Burke to present at future PMB
Standing Items
==============
SI-1 ALL: to provide any news items and meeting dates for the web page to SP.
SP asked about the possibility of an item about VO installation and JG
said he could help to provide input on newer VOs being supported in GridPP
context.
SI-2 Production Manager's weekly report of issues.
[Input from JC reviewed at the meeting]
1) The second LCG/EGEE operations workshop takes place in Bologna next
week (http://grid-it.cnaf.infn.it/workshop
http://agenda.cern.ch/fullAgenda.php?ida=a044377).
There is lack of a clear agenda.
Meeting will not have a good UK attendance (compared to previous).
2) The last UKI monthly support meeting (TB-SUPPORT)
(http://agenda.cern.ch/fullAgenda.php?ida=a052246) provided some useful
feedback (meeting notes will be available shortly) on the site
perspective of the 2.4.0 release. This will be fed back to the CERN
deployment team. Attendance at the meeting was fair but not excellent.
3) The Service Challenge work is progressing but still slowly. We are
defining clearer timescales for sites to be ready for testing but it is
still not entirely clear that the experiments want for the service phase
from September onwards. Friday's workshop
(http://agenda.cern.ch/fullAgenda.php?ida=a052961) was useful for
everyone involved but raised a few new questions! The File Transfer
Service for example is not yet ready for deployment. The upgrade route to
2.5.0 (1st July) is not clear for SC sites who aim to start the transfer
challenge on 1st July.
TD noted that the timing for the Service Challenge upgrade clashes with
GridPP13 which may result in some problems.
4) We still do not have the metrics we want implemented. There is an
increasing amount of information that can be used but nobody on the team
(with the required skills) is able to dedicate time to the task.
JG said he would discuss workload with JC.
5) The deployment team needs a better way of managing assigned work
and meeting actions. A free product is being trialed.
AOB
===
JG gave his apologies for next week's meeting. (JC and RJ will also be
away).
ACTIONS AT 16TH MAY 2005
=======================
157.2: RJ - review experiment computing models for Tier-1 to Tier-2
interactions in the UK.
157.9: RM to report on direction of GridPP in terms of middleware.
159.13: TC to extract LCG issues for GridPP13 talks
159.19: DB to make a list of all GridPP people and their roles
167.2: JC, with input from Stephen Burke to maintain a list of middleware
issues that should be addressed
167.3: RJ to define UK contacts for each experiment who will respond on
experiment operational issues.
167.5 DK to define a possible technical documentation role.
167.8 RJ to raise CDF deliverables definition with Todd Huffmann.
170.2: RJ to invite to representatives to talk to the PMB about GANGA status
170.3: DT to compile and issue a follow-up questionnaire to UB
170.4: TD to speak to COD people about the sound delay in the system
171.1: JG to communicate ADS-Castor planning from Dave Corney more widely
171.2: DB to ensure that SGE is not the priority for WLMS support
171.3: RM to ask Stephen Burke to present at future PMB
STANDING ITEMS
==============
SI-1 ALL: to provide any news items and meeting dates for the web page to SP.
SI-2 Production Manager's weekly report of issues.
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