yeeks, martin, my grateful thanks was grateful thanks.
no irony,
just thanks,
judy
> From: MJ Walker <[log in to unmask]>
> Date: 2005/12/11 Sun PM 03:52:45 EST
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: Poem/Play (was Re: Pinter on Blair et al.)
>
> Was I being that ridiculous? Oh well...
> Martin
>
> Judy Prince wrote:
>
> >my grateful thanks, MJ (sorry, don't know your first name). i'll die, surely, of profound ignorance and semi-tolerance, but somewhere within's a glimmer that Truth'll be made known to me, and that i'll recognize it. you've awakened that glimmer and awareness, thanks be to God.
> >
> >judy
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>From: MJ Walker <[log in to unmask]>
> >>Date: 2005/12/11 Sun AM 08:50:09 EST
> >>To: [log in to unmask]
> >>Subject: Re: Poem/Play (was Re: Pinter on Blair et al.)
> >>
> >>There is a longstanding debate about Seneca's practice & intentions with
> >>his plays. I believe more advanced theories support full-scale
> >>theatrical production during Nero's reign. Certainly the "progeny" of
> >>his drama, meaning Elizabethan tragedy, was generally meant for
> >>performance. The renewal of Senecan tragedy in English in the last
> >>century began with the very successful Peter Brook/Ted Hughes production
> >>with Gielgud & Worth - a great loss that it was never filmed. If Peer
> >>Gynt was only meant for reading, why did Ibsen then bother to get Grieg
> >>to compose the music for theatrical production? He understood that
> >>poetry and music go together well in the theatre - and reading can never
> >>supply that frisson. Flecker's The Golden Road to Samarkand, to cite a
> >>similar example, perhaps Britain's reply to the Theatre of Cruelty avant
> >>la lettre, had a very successful production in 1923 with the
> >>unforgettable music of Delius. As for Faust, it was, has been and is
> >>performed quite regularly in German-speaking countries (as is Madach's
> >>Tragedy of Man in Hungary & elsewhere). Try to see Peter Stein's amazing
> >>production (there must be a video, I taped it off the TV) with Bruno
> >>Ganz et al (two Fausts, two Mephistos).
> >>mj
> >>
> >>Knut Mork Skagen wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>>There is a dimension of the theatrical performance of a text, though,
> >>>>that creates a third consciousness (that is, one besides the
> >>>>audience-as-audience and the performer-as-performer), even in fairly
> >>>>traditional dramatic texts like my own, which are constructed with
> >>>>plot and character and all that stuff we've come to expect from a
> >>>>night out at the local playhouse. If I can be permitted an example
> >>>>from my recent play "In Public": a character in the second scene is
> >>>>sitting at a bar, flirting casually with a colleague, when she comes
> >>>>up with this monologue:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>I immediately think of two things when I read your examples and your
> >>>explanation of this extra dimension. The one of them you describe with
> >>>"spoken by the same actress within a 15 or 20 minute period" --
> >>>stating the obvious, drama, unlike poetry, is a time-based artform.
> >>>Lyric poetry is perhaps the least time-based form of literature, which
> >>>strengthens its role as object-on-the-page. It exists, in a sense,
> >>>without a proper beginning, end, or sense of time having passed.
> >>>
> >>>I also think of how a dramatic text is meant to be inhabited and
> >>>embodied by a performer -- mentioned earlier in this thread -- and it
> >>>seems to me critical to that the performer is not performing his or
> >>>her own words but those of a "character." (Character, of course, in
> >>>the broadest possible sense, given that less traditional drama won't
> >>>have such precise divisions). But still, the performative context of
> >>>a text is automatically a fictitious context. Even in performance art
> >>>where the performer is the writer is the character, the act of staging
> >>>produces an artificiality which enhances the impact of portions of the
> >>>text while reducing others.
> >>>
> >>>Contemporary lyric poetry isn't anywhere close to being staged, on the
> >>>contrary, it's often passed off as the opposite, some kind of "direct
> >>>communication." This may well be illusory, but is often an underlying
> >>>assumption on the part of the reader.
> >>>
> >>>There is a crossing somewhere. As drama approaches the purely literary
> >>>is enters the unperformable realm. Norway's own "national play" Peer
> >>>Gynt is meant to be read rather than staged; Goethe's Faustus;
> >>>Seneca's plays. And on the poetry end of things there is the point
> >>>where lyric crosses over into epic.
> >>>
> >>>--Knut
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>--
> >>M.J.Walker - no blog - no webpage - no idea
> >>
> >>Nous ne faisons que nous entregloser. - Montaigne
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> M.J.Walker - no blog - no webpage - no idea
>
> Nous ne faisons que nous entregloser. - Montaigne
>
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