> This is very discomfoting to me, as a member of the christian +left+, yes,
> it does exist, and for our sins we have to put up with the eternal
> embarrassment of association with the God-squad, we'd like to hate them
> but
> we're not supposed to do that, I dunno, we just believe in something like
> a
> notion of radical innocence, hopeless really, in this fallen world.
>
> Best
>
> Dave
>
Little lamb!
Dost tha *know who made thee?
joanna
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Roger Day" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Wednesday, October 26, 2005 9:53 AM
> Subject: Re: Geoffrey Hill: The Orchards of Syon
>
>
> And right on cue - I couldn't make this up - Blair introduces *his*
> Education White Paper basically handing over the education system to
> whoever wants it. That's not wuite right: he's *paying people to take
> it off his hands. Step forward the christian right. They never had it
> so good.
>
> Roger
>
> On 10/25/05, Joanna Boulter <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Roger Day" <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 4:19 PM
>> Subject: Re: Geoffrey Hill: The Orchards of Syon
>>
>>
>> Well, we've gotten back to Paley's arguments. I guess we're going to
>> be treated to the spectacle of rewinding the whole debate. My
>> grandparents believed wholeheartedly in the bible as literal fact.
>> They would have been creationists if the phrase had been invented.
>>
>> The US christian right thing is particularly scary because blair seems
>> intent on importing elements of it into this country. There are
>> already creationists teaching in schools in the north using debating
>> tactics similar to that of "intelligent" design.
>>
>> Roger
>>
>> Yeah, there are indeed. Those of us up here in the north who are in the
>> habit of thinking a bit find it disturbing.
>>
>> joanna
>>
>> On 10/25/05, Douglas Clark <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > I forgot to mention the keyword Intelligent Design which anyone with an
>> > elementary knowledge of biology knows is ridiculous.
>> >
>> > Douglas Clark, Bath, Somerset, England ....
>> > http://www.dgdclynx.plus.com
>> > ----- Original Message -----
>> > From: "Douglas Clark" <[log in to unmask]>
>> > To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> > Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 3:26 PM
>> > Subject: Re: Geoffrey Hill: The Orchards of Syon
>> >
>> >
>> > >I have a bad feeling about Warwick at the moment, although my niece
>> > >graduated there, cos Steve Fuller, the Sociology prof is giving
> evidence
>> > >in
>> > >support of Behe at the Kansas evolution trial. These people who oppose
>> > >the
>> > >Enlightenment are very much concentrated in Sociology departments
>> > >where
>> > >they argue that Science is just another discourse.
>> > >
>> > > Douglas Clark, Bath, Somerset, England ....
>> > > http://www.dgdclynx.plus.com
>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>> > > From: "Dominic Fox" <[log in to unmask]>
>> > > To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> > > Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 2:05 PM
>> > > Subject: Re: Geoffrey Hill: The Orchards of Syon
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > I saw Hill at Warwick University, where lots of other academic types
>> > > had also come to see him (there was some conference on, which I
>> > > wasn't
>> > > part of). So I went and I stood on my own, and I left on my own, and
>> > > shortly after that I gave up my PhD on Hill altogether. I think the
>> > > clincher was standing in line to have my copy of Speech! Speech!
>> > > signed, and the chap in front of me saying to Hill that he was
>> > > writing
>> > > a thesis on him, and could he please inscribe the book with something
>> > > encouraging like "don't give up! love, G.H.". Poor fellow, I wish him
>> > > no ill will, but a sort of terrible self-disgust welled up in me at
>> > > that moment. I did not confide my own aspirations to the great man: I
>> > > told him that I had liked the book very much, thanked him for signing
>> > > it, and left it at that.
>> > >
>> > > Hill himself was quite unlike the burly, black-cloaked figure
>> > > declaiming through clenched teeth that one might have been expecting
>> > > (although he is quite big). There was a touch of the music hall
>> > > performer about him, in fact; he made a great show of drinking a
>> > > glass
>> > > of water. Quite a musical voice - he was *performing* the work, and
>> > > its voices - so by turns discursive, lecturing, declamatory,
>> > > soliloquising and so on. He got quite a few laughs, especially out of
>> > > the material from Speech! Speech! People do rather miss the comedy in
>> > > Hill (I miss it myself, in much of The Orchards of Syon, although it
>> > > has its moments). There was also, this being a room full of
>> > > academics,
>> > > a fair amount of scribbling in notebooks as he brought the new stuff
>> > > out. Not my idea of how you listen to poetry, but then I was cribbing
>> > > from him on a deeper level. Or at least that was what I wanted to
>> > > tell
>> > > myself.
>> > >
>> > > Dominic
>> > >
>> > > On 10/25/05, Joanna Boulter <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > >> You've seen him read? Wow!
>> > >>
>> > >> What's he like as a reader? I mean, rhetorical, soliloquising, or a
>> > >> twist
>> > >> between incantatory and vicious -- I could imagine any of those
> styles
>> > >> fitting with the work.
>> > >>
>> > >> joanna
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> ----- Original Message -----
>> > >> From: "Dominic Fox" <[log in to unmask]>
>> > >> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> > >> Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2005 10:00 AM
>> > >> Subject: Re: Geoffrey Hill: The Orchards of Syon
>> > >>
>> > >>
>> > >> I saw Hill read some of the Orchards of Syon poems before they were
>> > >> published. They came across well in that context. I must admit
>> > >> though
>> > >> that the sequence doesn't really grab me - all those flame-pelts of
>> > >> denuded hawthorn, self-perjuring / arbiters of contrition |
>> > >> revamping
>> > >> their perdurance...
>> > >>
>> > >> Dominic
>> > >>
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > Shall we be pure or impure? Today
>> > > we shall be very pure. It must always
>> > > be possible to contain
>> > > impurities in a pure way.
>> > > --Tarmo Uustalu and Varmo Vene
>> > > --
>> > > This email has been verified as Virus free
>> > > Virus Protection and more available at http://www.plus.net --
>> > > This email has been verified as Virus free
>> > > Virus Protection and more available at http://www.plus.net
>> > >
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>> http://www.badstep.net/
>> http://www.cb1poetry.org.uk/
>>
>
>
> --
> http://www.badstep.net/
> http://www.cb1poetry.org.uk/
>
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