Hi Dominic,
Well, I guess I was reading the poem as it is, in its own terms, rather than as a reply to a particular view. That's my inclination in general. But I don't agree with this sort of easily divisible discourse into gender modes. For instance, it seems to me as much a cultural reality. I teach many Navajo students who in their silent passivity would be invariably 'feminine.' I guess I find even more sophisticated versions of "men are from mars, women are from venus," too simplistic and irritating. I don 't think I "read" your poem as you do, it doesn't seem to the max, it seems as much defined by its hesitancy, the number of clauses and phrases, so that I read it more as if it were a ventriloquist, a voice 'doing the max' or 'putting on the masculinist' tone.
Best,
Rebecca
Rebecca Seiferle
www.thedrunkenboat.com
-------Original Message-------
From: Dominic Fox <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: 04/16/03 04:07 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Gender Vendor
>
> On Wednesday 16 Apr 2003 6:02 am, you wrote:
> Dominic,
>
> I don't get it, how is this misogynist? without your preamble,
> I wouldn't have considered that as a frame for this particular
> work? I don't see how, without your frame/work, that this is
> identifiable as male and antifeminist? in fact, only the
> "he-man" who's not as quick as the quick-witted seems to get
> the worst of this.
First - and I'm surprised if you're not already acquainted with this -
some
Deborah Tannen.
<a target=_blank
href="http://raysweb.net/poems/articles/tannen.html">http://raysweb.net/poems/articles/tannen.html</a>
This article is somewhat anecdotal, and could be taken for John Gray-ish
"men
and women, zey are different" fluff, but it's actually summarising some
fairly interesting research into discursive styles. Tannen is
distinguished
in my view by her willingness to see the conflicts between discursive
styles
as broadly, rather than narrowly, political (in other words, she doesn't
just
map them directly onto a master/slave dialectic and leave it at that); and
by
her optimism, which is refreshing.
The discursive style the speaker in my piece is defending is, if you
accept
the way Tannen sees things as stereotypically falling out, decidedly
"masculine" - somewhat "to the max", in fact - and what is antifeminist
about
his posture is his utter impatience with and suspicious dismissal of the
claims of any other style, any other way of speaking and responding. Well,
I've gotten impatient myself at times; but I've also gotten past my
impatience at least some of the time.
It goes without saying that quick-tongued female speakers must surely be
vulnerable to the same impatience, and that there is no *necessary*
correspondence between a "masculine" discursive style and a male body or
social persona.
Dominic
>
|