----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Cooper" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2002 9:12 PM
Subject: Re: Climbing on a bad day


> Hi Arthur, (Sue & York & Sally & others...),
> Sorry I've not been able to respond to my comments sooner... (work is, as
> always, the curse of the poetry classes!)
> Yeh, adjectives & this poem... (maybe I wasn't being specific, when I
should
> have been... if so, sorry!) I'll try this way...
> Adjectives are part of the language tool-box. OK. But, like six inch
nails,
> just cos they're there doesn't mean they've always got to be used.
> I guess I wrote what I wrote because I recognise that y use nouns and
verbs
> so powerfully. (The way you use "mutes" (for instance) is so potent. I
guess
> I also see that some adjectives are unusual and unexpected (the fingers
> being blown to "ringing" life) and yet they sound so accurate to
experience.
> I want to say that about "whetted" wind as well - but, because of all the
> descriptiveness that's already happened with the rain in the first couple
of
> lines I feel as if my imagination's already overloaded!
> A poem, for me (but I sense not just for me) isn't just made up of
> independent sentences - it also has to flow (and all the poem's words
should
> be placed and pointed to go with the flow). Some of the words (in my way
of
> reading them) interrupt the flow by pointing me elsewhere. "Wolfish" seems
> like that to me... (Because "wolfish" sounds intrusive - there aren't any
> wolves, unless you're abroad - and I get no hint of y being elsewhere than
> the UK!). I struggle to follow the flow of words like "Buffets,"
"bullies,"
> rattles," and "bites" in the same sentence because I don't find it easy to
> associate such words-describing-a- child's-squabble language with the
> plumed-helmet language of later on in the poem. But, because this is a
> sonnet, and a sonnet has (at least) two different perspectives, the poem's
> form means I can accept it!
> However "ragged" steeps (which comes inbetween) is almost a mountaineering
> cliché (and VERY Victorian, almost like their Sunday school hymnody).
> And "A blessed relief" is a phrase that sounds not as old as Victorian
(but
> it doesn't sound over contemporary either) - and it could be that the
> adjective "blessed" could sound as if it's replacing a swearword... (Or,
if
> it isn't, it sounds rather twee!)...
> And another point I didn't make is that the (wonderful) way you describe
"my
> breath helmets my head with plumes of mist" is where you use words
> powerfully (but they're not as crowded together!) and that image of a
> person-in-armour links well with the following image of conquest! But, in
> our environmentally friendly age such imagery of conquering natural forces
> and places are rarely used (in fact, in most mountaineering literature
since
> the late 1970s it's sensitively avoided).
> And yes - like mountaineering stories, novels, and poems - that the hills
> (and the efforts to climb them) also allude to other, often personal
things,
> is almost taken as read. In Chinese poetry (Li Po onwards), in many
ancient
> myths (in many cultures), and in contemporary writing, that's what's
> happening (almost, it seems, by default).
> I've never managed, myself, to feel satisfied with my own writing about
> being in the hills in such bad weather in such a head-on kind of way. So I
> like what's you're attempting. And am offering advice to get you further
> than I could manage! Go for it!!
> And isn't it amazing that the Tower of Babel story (about an attempt to
> create a "mountain" as well as climb it) is a very early story and is also
> about understanding-and-misunderstanding words and language!
> Bob
>
>
>
> > > Climbing on a Bad Day.
> > >
> > > We turn from the cairn to face the flurries
> > > of a sleet-thick, bladed rain as it sheets
> > > down whetted wind. It buffets and bullies,
> > > rattles my hood and bites my chin and cheeks.
> > > Now only the wolfish weather and we
> > > dare the slopes and ragged steeps of the cwm
> > > where we stumble and find, under the lee,
> > > out of the wind-song, behind a rock, calm.
> > >
> > > Now the swuthering mutes, a blessed relief,
> > > my breath helmets my head with plumes of mist
> > > as I blow my fingers to ringing life.
> > > Hill of winds, cold, fatigue, selves, all overcome,
> > > we grin, no words, jubilant in conquest.
> > > Tomorrow's horizons already loom.
>
>
> >Thanks everyone for their generous and positive response to this shorter
> >poem.
> >  Interesting, Arthur. I agree with you about adjectives. I like the lost
> >gloves illustration! I didn't realise you meant us to get beyond the
> >fellwalking interpretation. I wonder how you could have madethis clearer.
> >sally ee
> >
> >Climbing on a Bad Day did not begin as a sonnet but some of the natural
> >rhymes that were offering themselves tempted me down that road and then I
> >was left with 14 ten -syllable lines to complete and the original did
lose
> >some of its terseness.
> >I am not going to contest the " too many adjectives " charge. Adjectives
> >are
> >part of the tools we have available to us.
> >I fancy it is a response mainly to " sleet-thick" " bladed" and "
whetted"
> >in the early part of the poem. In the context I think " sleet-thick" is
> >more
> >impactful than " thick with sleet" . In the same way "bladed" and "
> >whetted"
> >are better used, IMO, as they are and supercede" like a whetted blade" in
> >music and impact. Without the adjectives " wind " and " rain " become
just
> >"
> >wind and rain" and again ,IMO, less of the painful hazard they were. I am
> >not sure that " adjectives bleed nouns" is always appropriate or
accurate.
> >If I went to seek a pair of lost gloves at the LOST PROPERTY office a few
> >adjectives from me would aid the search.
> >I had hoped that the poem would also be read beyond the immediate
response
> >to the poetry and the event. Climbing and exploration
> >of self through climbing, the achievement,yes, the conquest,  give access
> >to
> >valuable resources useful in the daily struggle of living sometimes. The
> >last line refers, hopefully, to those other daily struggles under
demanding
> >conditions.
> >Still thank you everyone for your time and patience and generally
positive
> >,
> >and always civilised, reponses.
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.
> http://www.hotmail.com