Hi Jill,
well yes, that story of the courses, you come to the course and I make of
you a poet, you come to an art school and out you get as an artist, you
study medicine and here you are: a doctor, it does not make sense to me or
to anybody who went through any kind of studies. They all give you the basic
technique, plenty of indications (very useful ones if the teachers are
good), and that is the mere starting point. Years of experience, research
and attempts have to follow. You and me and us all we know that. I guess
your quoting me belongs to the thread of thought you were carrying out.
About Maria: I think she was re-evaluating in a loud voice (better in
written words) and sharing her digressions, which once in a while pop up
here and there also in me: country or city, bucolic or traffic-jammed,
traditional values (which to be saved) or a break-through, constant pacing
or just cut it all down and start anew...
Care to you all, we are in the middle of summer here, sunny bright days....
Anny
> > Hi Jill - the stock response - simply as witnessed by Adam's post - the
> > passion - what I feel, subjectively, is missing from the poetry that I
> > am currently reading - perhaps my mistake is to search in contemporary
> > poetry for work that deals with simple acts of human kindness;
> > community; love - endurance and the willingness to bear hardship without
> > blame - the understanding of trust that often comes from living outside
> > the urbane.
>
> Hi Maria,
>
> Am just back from 'the bush' (not sure that Bundanon really counts, but my
> shoes are dusty and the wombats were walking) so thanks for responding and
> interested to see what others are saying also.
>
> So, first of all, I'm not sure how Adam's is 'the stock response'. What is
> the stock response? Is it mine?
>
> About what you seem to be saying (but I'm happy to be corrected) - I'm
> wondering if we're back to that old one about Sydney vs The Bush, the
urban
> against nature and all that. You know, the one where anything to do with
> cities is superficial and corrupt while anything about the non-urban
closer
> to real, or 'natural', or fine, or something. I'm hoping not. That's the
Les
> Murray line (remember his disagreement with Peter Porter over this).
>
> Are you saying that all Australian urban poets don't write about hardship
or
> love, or, at least not with passion, but rather, with 'cringe' (I still
> don't quite get what you mean by that, in this context)? Do you equate
this
> 'cringe' with another thing you also said: "the urbane and inwardly
> reflective nature of much contemporary poetry"? Or do you think we're all
> try to pretend we live in New York or Paris?
>
> I'm glad that Douglas came in to say:
> >Certainly some of the 'urbane' (& urban) Australian poets I read neither
> >lose themselves simply in the landscape nor 'cringe.'
>
> I guess I will be arguing this one till I'm blue in the face, but - I live
> in a city, that's my landscape (I also write about other things, of
course).
> I find all sorts of things there that I argue with, get passionate about
> and, yes, reflect on in my work. And, yes, I confess, I'm pretty aware of
> ironies as well. But I'd do that anywhere I was. (And I continually find
it
> odd that Australians have a problem with anything reflective, but maybe
I'm
> misunderstanding you here as well.)
>
> I have no idea what contemporary Australian poets you are referring to.
Doug
> mentioned some of us. Perhaps it would help if you mentioned some that
> particularly let you down.
>
> It's easy to dismiss people just because they may have done a creative
> writing course (Anny's comment about "pre-packed material coming from
> specialized courses" makes a lot of assumptions about the courses and what
> anyone may or may not do outside, before or after such a course) rather
than
> talking about their work (do we dismiss artists who've done art classes as
> easily?) But there are creative writing course run in regional unis and
> colleges. Maybe they are turning out more 'authentic' poets.
>
> Look, I'm not an apologist for creative writing courses nor will I pretend
> I've not done the odd poetry workshop (nor bother to defend it) but, like
> Doug, I'm wondering who or what you are resisting. Resistance is fine, of
> course. I'm obviously doing it as well, but I'm still not quite clear what
> you are having the problem with and hence this quizzical, if not
passionate,
> response.
>
> Best,
> Jill
>
> _________________________________
> Jill Jones
> 50 Ruby Street
> Marrickville NSW 2204
> AUSTRALIA
>
> [log in to unmask]
> http://homepages.ihug.com.au/~jpjones
>
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