I'd side with Peter Howard who wrote:-
I suspect there is a bit of cross-purposeness in the discussion,
> with some talking about whether ampersands &c could ever have been used
> to interesting effect (of course they could), and others more concerned
> about the validity of their use today (much more difficult).
>
and I'd also note that Jacket 3 and Filth and Other Poems
contain a dedicatory sonnet of mine to the late John Forbes
(dedicating a suite of translations to the living Forbes),
which rhymes (after a fashion), is in iambic pentameter, and
which starts with an ampersand:-
I'll put it below for convenience:-
H u g h T o l h u r s t
Unfaithful Translations No 1
& where to tender my Catullus now,
to you dear John, my 10-speed bankrupt, Forbes?
The brave so soon become the editors
& scandal fucks but quarterly by vow;
I've bought the drinks before so you'll allow
submitting this one poem without cause,
about how flailing whales all know a pause
between your bike & pavement. Take a bow,
addled young elephant, or take this bribe:
if you can pedal those on fairer game,
my fiscal sonnet 'notes on creditors'
sees life in Phoenix Review. I'll subscribe
to Scripsi, John, or even once again
till payday call that thirty dollars yours.
Reprinted withpermission from Filth and Other Poems,
Black Pepper Press, 403 St Georges Road, North Fitzroy VIC 3068, Australia
ISBN 1-876044-17-9
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Howard <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Tuesday, July 11, 2000 6:37 AM
Subject: Re: Roddy Lumsden Re-Activates The Movement - Shock
> On Mon, 10 Jul 2000, David Kennedy wrote...
>
> >Oh get over yersel', big man! This sounds like a massively ill-informed
> >dismissal of strategies common to a multiplicity of innovative poetries
to
> >me and, by implication, of those poetries themselves. Won't do, really
won't
> >do at all.
> >
>
> I'd side with Roddy on this one. Certainly the techniques were *once*
> innovative, but anyone using them today is more than likely to be aping
> that innovation.
>
> But I suspect there is a bit of cross-purposeness in the discussion,
> with some talking about whether ampersands &c could ever have been used
> to interesting effect (of course they could), and others more concerned
> about the validity of their use today (much more difficult).
>
> --
> Peter
>
> http://www.hphoward.demon.co.uk/poetry/
>
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